The current American take on the Ghibli

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,149
They are struggling....But not in Europe.....As said before Italy and other parts it is selling well.....but the American market is a big one they need to do well....Doesn't sound like they are.
 

safrane

Member
Messages
16,847
Have to say the review reflects my own...that its a half arsed effort that is over priced.

Bi Turbo anyone? ??
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
Messages
9,038
The tech side is totally valid.
When the 4200 entered the world back in 2002, the tech side was very high.
Sat nav was very new and expensive together with HID headlights, with electric heated seats and parking sensors premium features.
Skyhook and cambiocorsa F1 gearbox all firsts as well for the market sector.
13 years on Maserati from being one of the first with tech, to being completely left behind!
 

BJL

Member
Messages
1,364
Made me smile. I think it was Phil a long way back said you can't polish a turd.

Why is Fiat launching the new 159 in blows your socks off form but launched the Ghibli in taxi form.

Beyond me......so sad
 

Swedish Paul

Member
Messages
1,810
"Why is Fiat launching the new 159 in blows your socks off form but launched the Ghibli in taxi form"

It's called Excel.
 

outrun

Member
Messages
5,017
At the risk of sounding different here, one bad review does not tell the whole story. As Matt pointed out recently, Americans buy one pick up truck per minute.

Here's my 2p worth and a little bit more about my findings so far.

Most of you know that I recently picked up my ex-demo Ghibli and immediately ran it to Le Mans for a spot of racing. It performed faultlessly on the 1400 or so mile trip.

The Car.

It's a "base" model 345bhp v6 petrol with many options as it's ex-demo. The list of options is impressive and includes sunroof, metallic paint, extended leather, heated seats, 21" titanium finish alloys, keyless go, navtrak which all go with the standard spec of sat nav, bluetooth streaming, climate, auto, park sensors, cruise, switchable exhaust etc.

Yes, it's true, there is no lane assist and no active cruise and until the 2016 model, the boot is not auto opening/closing. And the rear view camera is an option which I don't have.

What do I think so far?

I love it. It makes a great noise, build quality is excellent, materials tactile and stylish and the road presence is superb. There is plenty of power and it's so far returning a respectable 26.9mpg since I collected it (2000 miles now). I did see 33mpg on the run up from Kent after Le Mans but I was driving at 75 max for ages with the tunes on. I suspect 28 would be easy to average and 24 if you only drive in city areas mainly. The 21" wheels look great but it tramlines with the road cambers and follows freshly painted white lines. For those that don't need the big wheels (I do, I like the look!), I wouldn't go above 19" as the ride on the car I test drove was better. It does not, however, crash through bumps or potholes and to those who claim Skyhook is a must, I completely disagree. I test drove a Skyhook car and it did not impress me more than the standard car. I'd far prefer a slightly stiffer set up so that I can enjoy spirited driving when the mood takes me than worry about silky smooth progress. The gear selector is amusing and hard to master at first. It seems to go past the intended gear (ie you look for reverse from park and end up in neutral etc) but I've learned that if you think of it more as a button to choose gears rather than as a traditional auto gear knob, it starts to make sense and become easy to use. I suspect that over time I'll start to wonder why they're not all this way. The stereo is decent, I've heard the mega upgrade version is poor but can't comment as I've never heard it. It certainly Pis$$s all over the rubbish fitted to Gransports and 3200s etc. I'd like the reversing camera and recommend that is specced if you buy one. The paddles are also a must and where my only demand when searching for my car. No idea why they're not standard, at least on the petrol versions where the rev range and sport mode make them a lot of fun. In typical Italian style, you have to buy 8 way memory seats when you buy paddles making a £275 bit of metal into a £2200 option!! There are examples of this nonsense in every car so I won't chastise Maserati too much for following the herd here.

Is is better than a 5 series.

Nope but then why the F%%k would anyone want to look like a motorway cop? I don't care how good the 5er is. I don't want one. Never have. I test drove the M5. It's amazing and utterly soulless. I also drove the M4. Looks like a *** styled 3 and goes like stink but I honestly felt like a boy racer/footballer and that's not what I want in a car. It's better than the A6 though which I also drove. That has terrible steering with no feel at all. It's all so efficient that I'd probably need a Red Bull dispenser on board to avoid falling asleep at the wheel.

What have a I planned for it?

Remap for starters. The Ghibli S is 410bhp and the only real difference is a map. Gearbox, lump and turbos are the same. I've found a couple of options and looks like around 420bhp is sensibly achievable. I have no doubt that the chassis can handle it and some. I'll also make some changes to the exhaust note. I don't want to go loud like my Gransport so won't be going for full Larinis this time. I can get sports pipes, back boxes, cats etc from Larini, Quicksilver or Fabspeed but actually I'm looking at creating a bypass pipe that works above a certain rpm. It already has valved rear boxes which change note when sport mode is activated (a la Gransport) and the build looks nice on them. A friend had a bypass made for his QP and it did a great job for not much cash (for you Scots, that's Garry's QP). Seems silly not to try it before I blow circa £2k on backboxes. Other than that, I'm not changing anything. You wouldn't add a colour patch to an Armani suit and I won't ruin the Italian flair with any bolt on nonsense.

Summary

Just like whatever Maserati you own, there are many cars that are better but you don't own them. They don't have a soul, they don't have the same flair, they don't make you feel the same and they're just not as special. I've now owned 2 Gransports a 3200 and have my biturbo (currently being tweeked again) and so I guess I can now speak with some authority. I love Gransports but just about every 911 is a better car. Don't freak out here, I'd have a GS every time but its not the best car ever made and the build quality on some of it is pretty shocking. The 3200 is a lot of fun but flawed in many ways. You forgive the CELs, badly times turbo lag and the various issues because it has a heart and a passion that is difficult to better. I've driven a few QPs too and I also love these (you see the theme, I love all Maseratis!!) but come on, do you think it's a better car than its rivals?

In short, the Ghibli is more of the same from Maserati. It's magnificent, flawed a little, capable and usable. It makes me feel great and will do nicely as my daily driver thank you very much. I don't want to be a sheep. I don't want a German barge. If you do, perhaps you're reading the wrong forum.
 

bigbob

Member
Messages
8,966
At the risk of sounding different here, one bad review does not tell the whole story. As Matt pointed out recently, Americans buy one pick up truck per minute.

Here's my 2p worth and a little bit more about my findings so far.

Most of you know that I recently picked up my ex-demo Ghibli and immediately ran it to Le Mans for a spot of racing. It performed faultlessly on the 1400 or so mile trip.

The Car.

It's a "base" model 345bhp v6 petrol with many options as it's ex-demo. The list of options is impressive and includes sunroof, metallic paint, extended leather, heated seats, 21" titanium finish alloys, keyless go, navtrak which all go with the standard spec of sat nav, bluetooth streaming, climate, auto, park sensors, cruise, switchable exhaust etc.

Yes, it's true, there is no lane assist and no active cruise and until the 2016 model, the boot is not auto opening/closing. And the rear view camera is an option which I don't have.

What do I think so far?

I love it. It makes a great noise, build quality is excellent, materials tactile and stylish and the road presence is superb. There is plenty of power and it's so far returning a respectable 26.9mpg since I collected it (2000 miles now). I did see 33mpg on the run up from Kent after Le Mans but I was driving at 75 max for ages with the tunes on. I suspect 28 would be easy to average and 24 if you only drive in city areas mainly. The 21" wheels look great but it tramlines with the road cambers and follows freshly painted white lines. For those that don't need the big wheels (I do, I like the look!), I wouldn't go above 19" as the ride on the car I test drove was better. It does not, however, crash through bumps or potholes and to those who claim Skyhook is a must, I completely disagree. I test drove a Skyhook car and it did not impress me more than the standard car. I'd far prefer a slightly stiffer set up so that I can enjoy spirited driving when the mood takes me than worry about silky smooth progress. The gear selector is amusing and hard to master at first. It seems to go past the intended gear (ie you look for reverse from park and end up in neutral etc) but I've learned that if you think of it more as a button to choose gears rather than as a traditional auto gear knob, it starts to make sense and become easy to use. I suspect that over time I'll start to wonder why they're not all this way. The stereo is decent, I've heard the mega upgrade version is poor but can't comment as I've never heard it. It certainly Pis$$s all over the rubbish fitted to Gransports and 3200s etc. I'd like the reversing camera and recommend that is specced if you buy one. The paddles are also a must and where my only demand when searching for my car. No idea why they're not standard, at least on the petrol versions where the rev range and sport mode make them a lot of fun. In typical Italian style, you have to buy 8 way memory seats when you buy paddles making a £275 bit of metal into a £2200 option!! There are examples of this nonsense in every car so I won't chastise Maserati too much for following the herd here.

Is is better than a 5 series.

Nope but then why the F%%k would anyone want to look like a motorway cop? I don't care how good the 5er is. I don't want one. Never have. I test drove the M5. It's amazing and utterly soulless. I also drove the M4. Looks like a *** styled 3 and goes like stink but I honestly felt like a boy racer/footballer and that's not what I want in a car. It's better than the A6 though which I also drove. That has terrible steering with no feel at all. It's all so efficient that I'd probably need a Red Bull dispenser on board to avoid falling asleep at the wheel.

What have a I planned for it?

Remap for starters. The Ghibli S is 410bhp and the only real difference is a map. Gearbox, lump and turbos are the same. I've found a couple of options and looks like around 420bhp is sensibly achievable. I have no doubt that the chassis can handle it and some. I'll also make some changes to the exhaust note. I don't want to go loud like my Gransport so won't be going for full Larinis this time. I can get sports pipes, back boxes, cats etc from Larini, Quicksilver or Fabspeed but actually I'm looking at creating a bypass pipe that works above a certain rpm. It already has valved rear boxes which change note when sport mode is activated (a la Gransport) and the build looks nice on them. A friend had a bypass made for his QP and it did a great job for not much cash (for you Scots, that's Garry's QP). Seems silly not to try it before I blow circa £2k on backboxes. Other than that, I'm not changing anything. You wouldn't add a colour patch to an Armani suit and I won't ruin the Italian flair with any bolt on nonsense.

Summary

Just like whatever Maserati you own, there are many cars that are better but you don't own them. They don't have a soul, they don't have the same flair, they don't make you feel the same and they're just not as special. I've now owned 2 Gransports a 3200 and have my biturbo (currently being tweeked again) and so I guess I can now speak with some authority. I love Gransports but just about every 911 is a better car. Don't freak out here, I'd have a GS every time but its not the best car ever made and the build quality on some of it is pretty shocking. The 3200 is a lot of fun but flawed in many ways. You forgive the CELs, badly times turbo lag and the various issues because it has a heart and a passion that is difficult to better. I've driven a few QPs too and I also love these (you see the theme, I love all Maseratis!!) but come on, do you think it's a better car than its rivals?

In short, the Ghibli is more of the same from Maserati. It's magnificent, flawed a little, capable and usable. It makes me feel great and will do nicely as my daily driver thank you very much. I don't want to be a sheep. I don't want a German barge. If you do, perhaps you're reading the wrong forum.

OK with what you say Athol. I posted a reasonably friendly note on the Ghibli forum recently but no one ever logs on there. I am a skyhook fan but choice is there so fine that you have what you want.
 

outrun

Member
Messages
5,017
I wasn't referring to you Bob. I've read several USA based posts on the Ghibli forum mentioning Skyhook. I think they have a "keep up with the Jones's" think going on there as the Jalopnik post showed. If it's doesn't have this or that, it's not good enough. It's their age old mentality - how big is the engine, how many bhp, does it have a button that you push to make a call to a guy who can get you a table at The Ivy? None of that stuff is important to me. I want that thing that you can't describe, the thing you can't put you're finger on but you know when you have it.
 

bigbob

Member
Messages
8,966
I wasn't referring to you Bob. I've read several USA based posts on the Ghibli forum mentioning Skyhook. I think they have a "keep up with the Jones's" think going on there as the Jalopnik post showed. If it's doesn't have this or that, it's not good enough. It's their age old mentality - how big is the engine, how many bhp, does it have a button that you push to make a call to a guy who can get you a table at The Ivy? None of that stuff is important to me. I want that thing that you can't describe, the thing you can't put you're finger on but you know when you have it.

No probs on the skyhook point at all. Agree completely on the tech - most of it I don't want so it does not feature in my decision making.
 

Classico

Member
Messages
895
Very harsh review from our hot dog munching friends in the States.

To be fair, makes a number of valid points.

The piece is just confirmation you either get Italian cars, or you don't.

As we all know, It's rarely been about the tech. It's the design. The sound. The rarity. The willingness not to run with the pack. To take the road less traveled.

Would have stayed in my loaded Audi RS5 if that wasn't the case.

PS. Great review Outrun.

PSS. Saw a Black Ghibli on the road recently. Looked and sounded stunning.
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,629
Athol, fair play to you for jumping in an defending her honour, you saved me a job.

Agreed, if you want lane assist and all that b0llocks, buy German or if you want to be the one driving the car and want something different then buy the Gib.

Its a great looking understated ride with the coolest badge around, we dont need one jumped up American who values a car via the options list to preach to us who already know one of motorings undescovered gems.

As for the Alfa variant, sure it has the umph underneath but the marque has sold out to the yanks with a loaded options list and a face that will make milk curdle!

Rant over.
 
G

Guest 1678

Guest
I had the pleasure of riding in the back to the circuit in Athol's car.

Felt beautifully put together. Never felt underpowered and handled well for a big car. Ride is better than my last 2 Audis - A4 Allroad and a Q5. Every review of the German equivalents mentions hard ride, lack of soul and efficient motoring. I like my cars to talk to me and like me, be irritable occasionally. But as we all know - when they are on song...

As for the options - the car will evolve and with the electrical systems now being based on modules that can be enhanced we will see all the safety stuff trickle through. The MY 2016 Ghibli seems to have taken these items on board. Even Auto (Jag/BMW) Car amazingly acknowledged the difference:

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/maserati/ghibli/first-drives/2016-maserati-ghibli-diesel-review

making an accomplished car even better! still only gave it 3.5 stars.

I have to say I am trawling the classifieds and am very tempted. There are deals to be had and ultimately the option pack costs will be negated by the discounts available. As with all the manufacturers discounts apply. No-one is immune - the German and British makers have some massive 'dealer contributions'.

I do not buy my cars as a guarantee against depreciation or because they are the most efficient. I realise I am not the norm when it comes to the buying public. But as a group we share that same in-built urge to be different. Thank goodness we have a car maker who are not the homogenous mould shifters.

I am glad my flaws and peccadilloes are matched by the Trident boys and girls in Modena.
 

bigbob

Member
Messages
8,966
I think that the trick with all road tests is to read the text and take from it the bits that interest you. The star system tells me little especially if it is built on various features such as lane departure warning, adaptive cruise and massaging seats as I need none of them. As I said over on the Ghibli sub form, it is an ok car which has clearly improved in the Italian way. It could do with bigger wheels, paddles, metallic and electric seats as standard (and a tad more power) but these things maybe addressed when it is revised which inevitably it will be once the Alfa appears.