3200 TB & Pedal Pot

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
You have to insert your head and shoulders into the foot well to get the measurements. its not handy if you have a bad back! I have sent you a separate mail, but i reckon your problem may well be TB related and not the pedal sensor, not certain just my feeling.



Hi all,
I just fitted the contactless pedal pot today and reset the min and max values (maserati procedure). 1st time, ignition fine, idle fine but no response on the pedal. 2nd time, idle at 3000 rpm and a pedal response but can't stop the reving.... 3rd time idle at 2500 and reving.. Please don't tell me I have to take the pedal pot off.. It is very well manufactured, piece of art, but pain in the a.. to fit ! Although this has nothing to do with Davy but more with the car's architecture..
Thanks for your ideas, I will dive back in next saturday... 1st thing will be to check the calibration of the pot ? It means I have to move the plug as when fitted it's impossible to see the colors right ?
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
Good to hear from you David, i would also echo that most of the 3200 issues are TB related and of those i think most of them are mechanical, and not sensor related. i think a lot of people try replacing the pedal sensor because its cheaper and easier than dealing with the TB issue. i know I did when my TB starting acting up.

Wow! the amount of time that Throttle bodies have been the subject of conversation, and that I am sure throw guys in the wrong direction sometimes. The biggest plug is the contactless potentiometer, this fault is in my experience only 3% of the problems. I have refurbished so far 464 throttle bodies and yes the first 40 told me what the problems are. I fit contactless to all of mine because I am asked to, but it is not that much of an upgrade as at 3% failure is not bad. I rarely find time to converse on the forum but would like to just pass these comments. I am David Askew. The other thing is if you all fit turbo gauges, I am not plugging mine, mine are expensive anyway, but this added information may help in determining other faults when trying to assess problems.
 

Frog3200

Junior Member
Messages
52
Thanks Davy and thanks for your mail. I agree the reeving is more a TB symptom, or air leak. But the car has always been fine on that side, even the day before. Very small symptoms sometimes of moving idle, but never reeving. This why I was asking. It could be the odds though that all come at once and I was planning to send my TB to the UK someday.. It might be earlier than later... I will do some tests next satuday and check the TB and the buterfly movement. I read that if I unplug the pedal pot the engine should run at idle. If it does, the TB is out of concerns isn't it ?
 

allandwf

Member
Messages
10,958
You have to insert your head and shoulders into the foot well to get the measurements. its not handy if you have a bad back! I have sent you a separate mail, but i reckon your problem may well be TB related and not the pedal sensor, not certain just my feeling.

I can still picture you upside down in mine!
 

alfatwo

Member
Messages
5,517
Went over to see my old mate David Askew today, He's still rockin by the way!

Regarding TB's, apparently he's done over 400 3200 items to date plus lots of Lamborghini, Ferrari and Volvo stuff too

Dave
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
I do not think unplugging the pedal sensor will work sir. i have not tried this and not heard of anyone else trying it. the reason i think the sensor has two redundant outputs is because of the risk of the signal pins becoming disconnected floating high and causing high revs, so i don't think unplugging it is a good test, my gut feeling is you will get an ECU error and it wont start. i still think best plan is get the pedal sensor set up right and then move on to other possible problems. Can you get a loan of a good TB from some one?

Thanks Davy and thanks for your mail. I agree the reeving is more a TB symptom, or air leak. But the car has always been fine on that side, even the day before. Very small symptoms sometimes of moving idle, but never reeving. This why I was asking. It could be the odds though that all come at once and I was planning to send my TB to the UK someday.. It might be earlier than later... I will do some tests next satuday and check the TB and the buterfly movement. I read that if I unplug the pedal pot the engine should run at idle. If it does, the TB is out of concerns isn't it ?
 

Contigo

Sponsor
Messages
18,376
I do not think unplugging the pedal sensor will work sir. i have not tried this and not heard of anyone else trying it. the reason i think the sensor has two redundant outputs is because of the risk of the signal pins becoming disconnected floating high and causing high revs, so i don't think unplugging it is a good test, my gut feeling is you will get an ECU error and it wont start. i still think best plan is get the pedal sensor set up right and then move on to other possible problems. Can you get a loan of a good TB from some one?

It does start, as I said there is an ECU map which runs at 1000 rpm exactly.
 

StuartW

Member
Messages
9,306
Went over to see my old mate David Askew today, He's still rockin by the way!

Regarding TB's, apparently he's done over 400 3200 items to date plus lots of Lamborghini, Ferrari and Volvo stuff too

Dave

See post 58 Dave, Mr Askew posted on this thread last week
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
Well that's good to know and makes that a great test then!!! thanks for sharing, i must try this as soon as i get back to my car :). I know the 1000 rpm is coded into the ECU but didn't realise the ECU could ignore the pedal sensor not being there!



It does start, as I said there is an ECU map which runs at 1000 rpm exactly.
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
i have seen this before, but not at my car and cant work out if its a long time ago or it does it now! sport mode changes the way it looses revs quite dramatically, and it occasionally wigs out in sport mode and you have to switch it off to get it to idle properly. i think it may just be Italian! I suspect the ECU does a lot of unnecessarily complex things to work out how to control the TB, and this may be evidence of the history leading up to these throttle blips being different? it could of course just be your TB sticking because its on the way out, that's what normally goes wrong! :). Whats the error code you are getting there? could be related? could be an intermittent vacuum leak? if you were getting air into the plenum after the throttle butterfly was shut the revs would not drop off as quickly? maybe?
 

Contigo

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Messages
18,376
No reaction to the videos? am I the only one experiencing this?

I've told you before, sticking throttle body mate. You need to give it to Mike.

The ERROR code is one of your shock actuators or knackered shock adjuster.
 

Frog3200

Junior Member
Messages
52
Always read twice the instruction our teachters used to say... When I intalled the pot last week I linked the lever of the pot before bolting it back to the car. And I remembered this week that I had to apply a bit of pressure to bolt it... You guess the end of the story : the pot was not positionned at zero. So I corrected this today by adjusting the level of the pedal. And everything if fine, idle 1000rpm, not reeving...
However : now I can't manage to recalibrate the pot !! arrgh, I did it 5 or 6 times, I have no response on the pedal, always 1000rpm. Plus the CEL came on, with P0225 and P1225... My understanding is that since it was calibrated last week but with a higher voltage, it is now not understanding the undervoltage ??
Question : can I calibrate the pot with this codes in or I have to erase them first as they block the calibration ?
I put the car off circuit for the night and the battery on charge. Will try the calibration tomorrow at cold. But any ideas welcome...

Davy : you might want to add in the instruction the importance of adjusting the pedal physically, in case people don't read twice and think ! As I did... My appologies for that.
 

Ian3200

Member
Messages
841
I've told you before, sticking throttle body mate. You need to give it to Mike.

The ERROR code is one of your shock actuators or knackered shock adjuster.

Mike replaced it this year!

Yeah, I know what the Error thing is, that's not what the videos are about, just the slow rev drop...
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
Davy : you might want to add in the instruction the importance of adjusting the pedal physically, in case people don't read twice and think ! As I did... My appologies for that.[/QUOTE]

i have now written a detailed installation procedure for any one who suspects the mechanical set up has been tweaked or is not right. i can send it to any one who wants it.
If the pedal sensor idle position gives an output below .35v it will not calibrate, and there is no indication it has failed. Also if the two outputs are different by more than about 0.015v then it also will not calibrate and so it wont work. So i would check the two outputs are ok and also make sure the zero volts is steady. Connect one lead of you meter to the car body and measure the zero volts on the sensor leads and make sure its stable. another thing that's worth a try is to measure the voltage outputs on the car side of the connector and wiggle the connector around make sure no intermittent connections.
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
"And I remembered this week that I had to apply a bit of pressure to bolt it... You guess the end of the story : the pot was not positioned at zero."

You may have forced the lever into a new (and wrong) position relative to the rotary sensor so it wont work anymore? the key is the voltages, if you have moved the lever it will either a) read very low for the first few degrees of rotation (like 0.2 volts) and then suddenly start increasing, or will b) read high and no amount of adjustment will get it below 0.65v. I can either help you reset it (not as easy as it sounds) or you can send it to me and i can set it up again easy enough, i have a little mechanical jig for this.
 

Frog3200

Junior Member
Messages
52
Victory !
Thanks Davy, the key is indeed the voltage. Once I managed to have 2 small wires staying still in the brackets, I adjusted both lower position and higher position of the pedal to have 0,42 and 3,35 V (using the 2 adjustemt bolts). Calibration came in easily and the test drive made me discover a new car ! Smooth and easy to drive. CEL also went off. I can only encourage anyone to change their pedal pot to this contactless device...
Thanks Davy for this great invention !

For the bit of pressure, I meant a few degrees on the pot, nothing mechanically wrong. Therefore having the 0 at probably 1V...

In the end, no adjustment needed on the pot itself, but the adjustment of the pedal low and high are a must.