Why has this not sold?

safrane

Member
Messages
16,748
Gloomy outlook there Matt.

I agree that stratospheric rises will no doubt come to an end and face a reality check. But I cant see it impacting on softer rises in the rest of the market to the same level. If that was the case it would be mirrored across wider areas such as property etc.

Even if this was to come true we are talking 7/9k on most GSs. which is small beer in the scheme of things.
 

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,038
It's more complex than that. There's an element that people are generally sheep hence the huge number of German metal around the place. It's also certainly true that the market positioning and model range that Maserati is currently offering is alienating several segments of the buying public. They are seen as expensive and stuffy - very similar to Jaguar of 15 years ago except that Jaguar still had entry level cars (albeit based on Ford products) which kept the badge within reach of many. Good cars sell quickly usually - just ask Dicky. A smaller SUV may help this positioning but the EU perception of diesels has proved to be impacting the Ghibli negatively. There's also the issue of financing packages which Maserati are utterly useless at. Even the lease deals are expensive compared to others. Take a look at what Mangolesti can offer to get you into a Gulia Veloce and compare that to Maserati's offering on the Ghilbi. They are so far out of touch that it's embarrassing. At the high end, it's easy to get 50-60% GFV on a Ferrari which helps keep the monthly cost down but cars like the Granturismo are struggling to get a GFV of 35% which means you pay the same monthly for a 100k California as you do for a 60k Granturismo. All these factors add up to harm brand perception and force people to buy elsewhere.

Not sure the reason there is lots of German metal about is because people are sheep......more because they make excellent cars....and the reputation for reliability is better.....may only be a perception but unfortunately it sells cars. Was talking to a few chaps in work about cars and they asked what I had owned...When I said I had a TVR and Lotus they said bet they weren't reliable and then I mentioned the Maserati and they said you must be a sucker for punishment, bet it was in the garage more than on the road. Thing is all three Marques were reliable. People still think a Maserati will break down...Not sure what they need to do to change this perception.....But yes agree with your points...Lots hitting sales of these cars and it doesn't feel it will get better. Driving a flash big engine sports car doesn't get the same reaction these days ..... We are in a minority's these days...

Really interesting point on the GFV. Those 50%/60% still show confidence from the manufacturer in their products and how the market perceives the Marque.....You see this with Ferrari and Aston Martin.....Always amazes me how dealers don't sell older models from their range and don't like much over 5 years old. Is this because it costs too much to get up to standard, could cost a fortune for the warranty company.....?....Eitherway it does show confidence in the product. A few high end seem to buck this trend though....You find 2005 Vantages still selling through main dealers.....When was the last time you saw a GS at a main dealer. When I bought my 5 year old C Class from Mercedes they said we don't usually stock cars this old but this was such a nice example.....5 years is sod all.....Keeps used car dealers in stock I suppose.
 

dickygrace

www.richardgracecars.co.uk
Messages
7,309
Meridien sold a GS last year. German quality, have you driven an A Class, a GLA? Not good at all; most proper Merc’s are great cars though. Thing is, the A Class is surely their biggest seller, but that’s because people want looks first, not quality. Look how many Evoques are on the road too...
 

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,038
Meridien sold a GS last year. German quality, have you driven an A Class, a GLA? Not good at all; most proper Merc’s are great cars though. Thing is, the A Class is surely their biggest seller, but that’s because people want looks first, not quality. Look how many Evoques are on the road too...

So 1 then Dicky..bet it was a garage queen..Still not a great advert though for older cars. It’s left to people like you to champion the marque. Don’t like the little Mercedes....a 1 series is a far better car......Surely the first thing that attracts you to a car is it’s looks anyway....If you don’t like the looks most people wouldn’t pursue further.
 

Nayf

Member
Messages
2,734
Do like that blue GS he has...and reasonable miles given the age.

I would have thought the clutch wear to be the bigger issue on that one, but it has gone past 50% so looks like the tangs have survived.
Drove that GS (and the light metallic blue 3200) and it was rather wonderful. Doesn't feel like it's done 50k...
 

MrPea

Member
Messages
3,012
This is a weird one. When I bought my GS Spyder just over 2 years ago, 7 of them changed hands within about 8 months! There was definitely competition to buy mine; I remember Robin's lovely red one having competition resulting in a guy sourcing a LHD as he was too late. Maybe it is a combination of colour and condition?
I remember that Oxford Maserati had a stunning yellow Strad for 9 months before selling it, but they didn't shift much on price when it did sell.
 

Nayf

Member
Messages
2,734
It's more complex than that. There's an element that people are generally sheep hence the huge number of German metal around the place. It's also certainly true that the market positioning and model range that Maserati is currently offering is alienating several segments of the buying public. They are seen as expensive and stuffy - very similar to Jaguar of 15 years ago except that Jaguar still had entry level cars (albeit based on Ford products) which kept the badge within reach of many. Good cars sell quickly usually - just ask Dicky. A smaller SUV may help this positioning but the EU perception of diesels has proved to be impacting the Ghibli negatively. There's also the issue of financing packages which Maserati are utterly useless at. Even the lease deals are expensive compared to others. Take a look at what Mangolesti can offer to get you into a Gulia Veloce and compare that to Maserati's offering on the Ghilbi. They are so far out of touch that it's embarrassing. At the high end, it's easy to get 50-60% GFV on a Ferrari which helps keep the monthly cost down but cars like the Granturismo are struggling to get a GFV of 35% which means you pay the same monthly for a 100k California as you do for a 60k Granturismo. All these factors add up to harm brand perception and force people to buy elsewhere.

It’s not just Maserati. The first finance plans for the Quadrifoglio on launch pegged it at £25k to £28k (IIRC) after three years. Talk about taking a dump with your trousers on. The market seems to be performing better, largely because demand is higher than supply...
 

zagatoes30

Member
Messages
20,759
So 1 then Dicky..bet it was a garage queen..Still not a great advert though for older cars. It’s left to people like you to champion the marque. Don’t like the little Mercedes....a 1 series is a far better car......Surely the first thing that attracts you to a car is it’s looks anyway....If you don’t like the looks most people wouldn’t pursue further.

I really dislike where Mercedes have gone recently, another manufacturer making niche cars for niches that don't currently exist, a bit of build it and they will come. This questions the mentality of Joe Public who think because Mercedes have built a niche car it must be for them even though in the past they have never needed such a thing. The A class, GLA, those silly coupe style SUV things etc. etc.

Oh and I don't like the overall Merc styling at the moment C, E class whatever class all look like they are trying to hard.

Sorry, Rant over
 

zagatoes30

Member
Messages
20,759
This is a weird one. When I bought my GS Spyder just over 2 years ago, 7 of them changed hands within about 8 months! There was definitely competition to buy mine; I remember Robin's lovely red one having competition resulting in a guy sourcing a LHD as he was too late.

One of my big regrets, I knew at the time that stretching my budget to buy Robins Red one was the right thing to do but I let the prudent side of my head hold sway.
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
I really dislike where Mercedes have gone recently, another manufacturer making niche cars for niches that don't currently exist, a bit of build it and they will come. This questions the mentality of Joe Public who think because Mercedes have built a niche car it must be for them even though in the past they have never needed such a thing. The A class, GLA, those silly coupe style SUV things etc. etc.

Oh and I don't like the overall Merc styling at the moment C, E class whatever class all look like they are trying to hard.

Sorry, Rant over
I agree with the direction comment re the GLA but disagree with just about everything else Merc related here.
I've a C class (admittedly a top spec car) and love the styling. I can understand why they all look the same.... IMO it's lovely and not trying too hard at all. additionally, the cabin quality is superb, the technology incredible and it's comfortable, economical, reliable and bloody fast.
It's a fabulous car and rightly deserved it's world car of the year award 2015 from my experience.
The only thing it doesn't do (unless I guess you get the AMG) is give you the trouser tingle of a Maserati- but then you wouldn't expect it too!

Cheers Wattie
 

bigbob

Member
Messages
8,952
I agree with the direction comment re the GLA but disagree with just about everything else Merc related here.
I’ve a C class (admittedly a top spec car) and love the styling. I can understand why they all look the same.... IMO it’s lovely and not trying too hard at all. additionally, the cabin quality is superb, the technology incredible and it’s comfortable, economical, reliable and bloody fast.
It’s a fabulous car and rightly deserved it’s world car of the year award 2015 from my experience.
The only thing it doesn’t do (unless I guess you get the AMG) is give you the trouser tingle of a Maserati- but then you wouldn’t expect it too!

Cheers Wattie

You havn't told us to buy gold instead.
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,593
Problem is, the lower Mercs are Renaults underneath and look below knee level in the cabin and it shows.

Merc are pushing cheap cars based on the badge...sounds very familiar if you ask me...the way of the modern world I suppose, more about style over substance.

Never bought a Merc but would, out of the German brands, its the one that appeals to me the most. Come lease time each 2 or 3 years, I do look at them but would not be interested in any of the Renualt based products so that usually rules it out on price.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
Not sure the reason there is lots of German metal about is because people are sheep......more because they make excellent cars....and the reputation for reliability is better.....may only be a perception but unfortunately it sells cars.

'Most' people do buy German metal because they ARE sheep. I would say 90% of them are.

I would also say 90% of 3 series drivers do not know a thing about their car, and probably think that servicing them is checking the air in their tyres. That's when the tyre pressure sensor tells them.
People buy 3 series and A4's because the brand 'tells them' they are doing well in life and the advertising tells them that they are cars to aspire to.

The advertising has done it's job. As if you were buying a car on how it drives and reliability and all the other things which (in theory) you should do when you buy a car, you wouldn't go anywhere near them.
Alex had a 3 series (320i M Sport) it was awful. **** seats, **** gear change, **** handling, **** reliability, good job it was a company car as otherwise I would have taken it back to the dealer. Well, other than the numerous times it needed to go back.
The Audi A3 she replaced it with was almost as bad. Just duller.

The most reliable cars I've ever had have been my Alfa 156 2.0 TS, and my E 350D AMG Sport Merc.
The Alfa isn't on anyones list of cars to aspire to, but like all Alfa's look after the car and it will look after you. It also had a great engine and the handling was pretty good as well.
The Merc, yes it is an 'Executive' car and therefore should be good if you consider the cost new, but it does everything well, but nothing great, I bought it as a mile muncher and it does that perfectly. Which is why E Classes are the taxi of choice.

These days people buy cars because of what the advertising tells them to buy.
People buy Maserati's because they want to be different, and they have that little something that you cannot define in an advert. In a Maser you'd take 5 days of it being in the garage for that one weekend of epic driving.

The thing is. How do you put that in an advert? If Maserati can figure that out, they'd sell cars like hot cakes!
 

safrane

Member
Messages
16,748
Have plenty of MBs as my weekly rentals. E class and above are fine. C class feels ok when new but feels so light now...like tin foil. The center console plastics scratch from day one.

They are nothing like they used to be...carved from granite!
 

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,038
'Most' people do buy German metal because they ARE sheep. I would say 90% of them are.

I would also say 90% of 3 series drivers do not know a thing about their car, and probably think that servicing them is checking the air in their tyres. That's when the tyre pressure sensor tells them.
People buy 3 series and A4's because the brand 'tells them' they are doing well in life and the advertising tells them that they are cars to aspire to.

The advertising has done it's job. As if you were buying a car on how it drives and reliability and all the other things which (in theory) you should do when you buy a car, you wouldn't go anywhere near them.
Alex had a 3 series (320i M Sport) it was awful. **** seats, **** gear change, **** handling, **** reliability, good job it was a company car as otherwise I would have taken it back to the dealer. Well, other than the numerous times it needed to go back.
The Audi A3 she replaced it with was almost as bad. Just duller.

The most reliable cars I've ever had have been my Alfa 156 2.0 TS, and my E 350D AMG Sport Merc.
The Alfa isn't on anyones list of cars to aspire to, but like all Alfa's look after the car and it will look after you. It also had a great engine and the handling was pretty good as well.
The Merc, yes it is an 'Executive' car and therefore should be good if you consider the cost new, but it does everything well, but nothing great, I bought it as a mile muncher and it does that perfectly. Which is why E Classes are the taxi of choice.

These days people buy cars because of what the advertising tells them to buy.
People buy Maserati's because they want to be different, and they have that little something that you cannot define in an advert. In a Maser you'd take 5 days of it being in the garage for that one weekend of epic driving.

The thing is. How do you put that in an advert? If Maserati can figure that out, they'd sell cars like hot cakes!

Other end of the scale for me....The most unreliable cars I've owned has been a Alfa 156 Sportwagon and an Alfa Brera.....Hatefully unreliable....Where as I've never had a BMW let me down once and had a few.....and definitely not a sheep either.

Must say I have been impressed with the quality of my 2013 C class....But the older shape they got tight. The one before it was dire and the newer one doesn't feel as solid as the last one.
 

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,038
I really dislike where Mercedes have gone recently, another manufacturer making niche cars for niches that don't currently exist, a bit of build it and they will come. This questions the mentality of Joe Public who think because Mercedes have built a niche car it must be for them even though in the past they have never needed such a thing. The A class, GLA, those silly coupe style SUV things etc. etc.

Oh and I don't like the overall Merc styling at the moment C, E class whatever class all look like they are trying to hard.

Sorry, Rant over

Me...the latest C class coupe thing is just horrid. The styling just doesn't work especially the back.