GS won't start

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,594
Just looked at the drawings and yes it is under the exhaust manifold on the near side (left) of the engine.

If you can get the front up on axle stands or ramps you might be able to test it yourself.

Maybe worth taking off the engine covers and see if you can get to it that way?

Don't lean on the wings and you don't need to remove the bonnet strut you can swing the cover 180 degrees out or the way.
 

maseratimike7

Member
Messages
364
Thanks guys I guess this will be my task today providing I can get the car high enough

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,594

Otherside mate behind the AC pump opposite side from the oil/waterpump.

Nearside/curbside/passenger side

You will also see that starter motor item 24 cable goes up to mounting block item 33 on the bulkhead so you can test for current at this point without having to jack the car.

Wire up a voltmeter to this thick cable and the negative to earth/chassis and see if you get 12v when you press the start. Be careful as there is about 100 amps that will be at this point.

There are also some fuses on the bulkhead, worth checking them too.
 

maseratimike7

Member
Messages
364
Ok gents update.

Checked starter motor all associated positive and negative cables reading over 12v with no issues.

At this point I went to recycle the fuses and relays in the footwell panel while also testing again.

After replacing all went to start the car and it worked!

Volt guage was less than a quarter and went to read the battery, while the car was running and under load was 11.7!!!

I have a new altenator which I tested and it's 100% along with the new battery.

When I started the car I left the panel off the footwell fuse box and heard a spark sound when I fired it up so while it was running I ran my fingers over the fuses and relays.

Panel A position C and D for devices cut out and not cut out were very hot!

Shut the car down and tried to start again but back to square one with nothing happening.

I removed each one of these relays and tried to start to check connection for starter button and motor and while it didn't start due to PTS it cranked and proves that the starter and button are ok.

I tested the resistance in both C and D both are normal.

Do you think it's worth replacing them as they were very hot and might be causing the problem?

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,594
Ok, some progress which is good.

Whist you conduct your testing I would make sure you have a CO2 fire extinguisher to hand just in case.

My first question to ask is has the passenger footwell fuse panel suffered water ingress. I ask this as it sounds like you have shorts plus for relays to break down its water that accelerates this.

Look for water in the base under the fuse panel and also dripping down into the footwell from either the matrix (central) or more likely the pollen filter.

It might, if you have time and want to be thorough, to remove the scuttle panel and see if the pollen filter (under the scuttle panel directly above the fuse box) has water sitting in the bottom or the element is saturated.

If not, then as you say, replace the relays.

Initially I would mark the one you think is suspect and swap it with a similar one from the same panel and see if the fault moves to another system.

When the car is running, putting a volt meter over the battery, you should see a voltage of over 14v, ideally 14.4v. If not, then the battery is not being charged and that points to your alternator. They are know to become noisy then fail. Exchange refurbished items are also known not to last as the diode packs blow and the voltage cant then not be regulated.

There has also been cased of them catching fire and overcharging the battery till it swells and then if continue, it will explode so be very carful and at least wear eye protection whilst you examine it.

Sounds like you are on the right track and we can rule out the starter, immobiliser, buttons and battery.
 

conaero

Forum Owner
Messages
34,594
This may help you, the starter relay is R7 in BLOCK C (you can swap with R8 or R9 from BLOCK A) to the left of the main fuse board and F12 for ignition:

see post #6 here: http://www.sportsmaserati.com/showthread.php/3460-Fuel-pump-fuse-and-relays



fuses.jpg


A PANEL
F5-30A-Headlight washer timer
F44-30A-+30 Driver's seat
F45-30A-+30 Passenger's seat
F46-7,5A-Passenger's seat heating
F47-7,5A-Driver's seat heating
F50-7,5A-Air conditioning and ventilation unit
R8-30A-Connected devices cut out during ignition
R9-30A-Connected devices not cut out during ignition

R17-20A-Passenger's seat heating
R18-20A-Driver's seat heating

B PANEL
F9-10A-+87 main relay
F10-15A-+87 Lambda sensor main relay , air flow meter
F11-15A-+87 main relay for injectors, coils
F28-7,5A-A.C. Compressor
F29-15A-Horns
F51-10A-+15 ABS
R4-20A-A.C. Compressor
R5-20A-Immobilizer
R6-20A-Main injection
R10-20A-A.C. Compressor, horns

C PANEL
F13-30A-Starter motor
F32-10A-RH High beam light
F33-10A-LH High beam light, warning light
F34-15A-Fog lights
F35-15A-Left-hand low beam
F36-15A-Right-hand low beam, headlight washers inhibitor switch, manual headlight angle adjuster
R7-30A-Starter motor
R11-20A-Fog lights
R12-20A-High beam lights
R13-20A-Low beam lights

D PANEL
F6-10A-Headlight washer timer
F7-30A-Main injection
F8-7,5A-+30 injection
F12-15A-+30 ignition switch
F14-5A-Air conditioning and ventilation system, navigator cable bundle, (+15 connected devices cut out during ignition)
F15-15A-Cigarette lighter, radio, engine indic., rear view mirrors, ceiling light, glove compartment lamp (+15 cut out during ignition)
F17-25A-Windshield wiper, windshield wiper washing pumps, wiper(+15 cut out during ignition)
F18-10A-Airbag (+15 connected devices not cut out during ignition)
F19-5A-+15 NCS (+15 connected devices not cut out during ignition)
F20-7,5A-Immobilizer, CAN line interface, navigator cable bundle instrument(+15 not cut out during ignition)
F21-5A-Alarm system, preset for satellite alarm
F22-10A-Ceiling lights, ceiling light timer, (electronic) seats , luggage compartment and fuel flap opening controls
F23-7,5A-ECU for CAN line interface, OBD, Maserati CODE system, multifuncion display
F24-20A-Door locking system
F25-15A-Radio, navigator
F26-30A-Driver side power windows
F27-30A-Passenger side power window
F30-10A-+15 light switch, Cruise Control, headlight aiming ECU (+15 cut out during ignition)
F31-15A-Turn signal light blinking
F37-15A-+30 IGE ECU
F38-15A-+30 IGE ECU
F39-5A-IGE ECU, ceiling light timer, light switch (+15 connected devices not cut out during ignition)
F40-10A-Stop, clutch
F53-10A-Navigator, clock, tunnel display
F70-15A-Exhaust bypass solenoid valve


145.jpg

View attachment 44989

View attachment 44990

149.jpg

150.jpg

152.jpg

154.jpg
 

maseratimike7

Member
Messages
364
This may help you, the starter relay is R7 in BLOCK C (you can swap with R8 or R9 from BLOCK A) to the left of the main fuse board and F12 for ignition:

see post #6 here: http://www.sportsmaserati.com/showthread.php/3460-Fuel-pump-fuse-and-relays



fuses.jpg


A PANEL
F5-30A-Headlight washer timer
F44-30A-+30 Driver's seat
F45-30A-+30 Passenger's seat
F46-7,5A-Passenger's seat heating
F47-7,5A-Driver's seat heating
F50-7,5A-Air conditioning and ventilation unit
R8-30A-Connected devices cut out during ignition
R9-30A-Connected devices not cut out during ignition

R17-20A-Passenger's seat heating
R18-20A-Driver's seat heating

B PANEL
F9-10A-+87 main relay
F10-15A-+87 Lambda sensor main relay , air flow meter
F11-15A-+87 main relay for injectors, coils
F28-7,5A-A.C. Compressor
F29-15A-Horns
F51-10A-+15 ABS
R4-20A-A.C. Compressor
R5-20A-Immobilizer
R6-20A-Main injection
R10-20A-A.C. Compressor, horns

C PANEL
F13-30A-Starter motor
F32-10A-RH High beam light
F33-10A-LH High beam light, warning light
F34-15A-Fog lights
F35-15A-Left-hand low beam
F36-15A-Right-hand low beam, headlight washers inhibitor switch, manual headlight angle adjuster
R7-30A-Starter motor
R11-20A-Fog lights
R12-20A-High beam lights
R13-20A-Low beam lights

D PANEL
F6-10A-Headlight washer timer
F7-30A-Main injection
F8-7,5A-+30 injection
F12-15A-+30 ignition switch
F14-5A-Air conditioning and ventilation system, navigator cable bundle, (+15 connected devices cut out during ignition)
F15-15A-Cigarette lighter, radio, engine indic., rear view mirrors, ceiling light, glove compartment lamp (+15 cut out during ignition)
F17-25A-Windshield wiper, windshield wiper washing pumps, wiper(+15 cut out during ignition)
F18-10A-Airbag (+15 connected devices not cut out during ignition)
F19-5A-+15 NCS (+15 connected devices not cut out during ignition)
F20-7,5A-Immobilizer, CAN line interface, navigator cable bundle instrument(+15 not cut out during ignition)
F21-5A-Alarm system, preset for satellite alarm
F22-10A-Ceiling lights, ceiling light timer, (electronic) seats , luggage compartment and fuel flap opening controls
F23-7,5A-ECU for CAN line interface, OBD, Maserati CODE system, multifuncion display
F24-20A-Door locking system
F25-15A-Radio, navigator
F26-30A-Driver side power windows
F27-30A-Passenger side power window
F30-10A-+15 light switch, Cruise Control, headlight aiming ECU (+15 cut out during ignition)
F31-15A-Turn signal light blinking
F37-15A-+30 IGE ECU
F38-15A-+30 IGE ECU
F39-5A-IGE ECU, ceiling light timer, light switch (+15 connected devices not cut out during ignition)
F40-10A-Stop, clutch
F53-10A-Navigator, clock, tunnel display
F70-15A-Exhaust bypass solenoid valve


View attachment 44995

View attachment 44989

View attachment 44990

View attachment 44991

View attachment 44992

View attachment 44993

View attachment 44994
Thanks CA!

Checked the footwell no leaks or dampness at all.

I recently completed a service on the car and check the housing when I changed the pollen filter which was clean. I also carried out the modification to help the drainage via the how to guide.

Nothing coming from the Matrix thank God so the heated/faulty relays must be from wear or a one off problem.

Any ideas where I could purchase relays if the same pin and resistance other than a dealer, not sure if this is a common fault that people have reported back on?

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk
 

CatmanV2

Member
Messages
48,557
Halfords. Relays are just relays. As long as they have the same pin size and Amperage rating, it'll be fine. It's just a switch

C
 

voicey

Member
Messages
660
Halfords. Relays are just relays. As long as they have the same pin size and Amperage rating, it'll be fine. It's just a switch

C

I would caveat that with the need to check for resistors and flyback diodes - very common inside a relay and important for circuit protection.
 

maseratimike7

Member
Messages
364
Relays replaced with new ones of equal grade, still no start it attempt.

As I managed to start it by fiddling with everything last time it has to be something around the footwell fuse box.

Will be pulling the entire unit out to see if a wire has came undone from the back etc.

The fight continues......

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk
 

maseratimike7

Member
Messages
364
No lose wires at the back of the panel and everything seems as it should.

Probably a bit of a stupid question but I have a spare plug hanging is this normal?

Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk
 

maseratimike7

Member
Messages
364
Plus coming from the main harness, 4 pin connection, colour white/yellow, beige, black and green/red?
901e7ffcce1cf6dee1f9d68ca79f1ca2.jpg
4ebbe60674127909187c53475aa7ef0d.jpg


Sent from my SM-A300FU using Tapatalk