Nhs

Absolutely brilliant NHS
I fell off my Mt Bike this morning on some ice in the woods. Totally my fault, no protective wear (I know, I know).
Had to walk the bike and myself home - about a mile, pushing the bike on its rear wheel with the front end all damaged. I was lucky.
I thought maybe my collar bone was damaged so off to A & E.
Place was empty and I was whisked through and x ray followed and nothing is broken.
I ache all down LHS and I am sure it will be worse tomorrow.

Learned some lessons and so grateful for NHS

Feel for you Dave,
I did similar 2 years ago, only I didn't got to A & E, and it turns out I did break it,
Gives me grip all the time, only on road for me now, and not when it's icy...
Dave

NHS is great...and when private goes wrong its where they send you to fix the problems.

Yes there are waits, but thats down to those who should not be there or who's lifestyle or stupidly fills up the available slots.

Doctors and nurses of the NHS are true heroes....

Whilst I am completely in favour of universal and free (ie paid through taxes) health care, I think there's too much emphasis on Doctors and Nurses being 'heroes' . Yes they do a great job in stitching us up when we've been unfortunate or idiotic but let's not forget that the UK's most prolific murder was a Doctor (250) and in Germany a nurse killed 90!

Granted they were exceptions rather than the rule and the vast majority do a great job. My argument is that they are paid to do a job much like the rest of us. I'd rather praise the man who unclogs the sewers in London or any other city. He probably gets paid a lot less than any trainee nurse and is in sh!t up to his ankles ever day. Be thankful to them as well.

I think the best picture highlighting our double standards and generalisation of society was published by the countryside alliance. Again not a belief I support but it does make you think.

Andyk said:

Doctors and nurses of the NHS are true heroes....

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You are spot on there !
My daughter is a mental health nurse, 13 hour shifts, often with no time for a break, often wards understaffed - but she takes it all in her stride thinking only of the patients - who sadly are not always able to be appreciative.

Yep!!...........Our son was born 3 months premature at 1lb 6oz at the Liverpool Women's Hospital. We were aware through specialists that this would be the case. We had 3 months of professional care 24/7 and luckily he came out 100% The staff were fantastic and became good friends, and we still go back to see them every now and then when we are in the area...........Imagine how much that would cost if you lived in the US or other countries that don't have an NHS!!
The surgeon cut short his mothers funeral to fly back in time to deliver him!

Thanks to the NHS we have a spotty teenager with attitude who thinks he's gods gift to women

I also used NHS, for a detached retina op last year. I can only praise them. But what I did notice was that each day I had to run a gauntlet of patients outside, in gowns, pyjamas, or worse in chairs all smoking away in the clearly labelled,and announced, no smoking area at the Hospital entrance. They were all in to have something attended to, so they could at least try and help themselves.

The NHS staff are brilliant, its the system and there go funding that is the issue putting a ridiculous amount of stress on the staff.

We should all indeed but very thankful of the wonderful service they attempt to deliver.

Glad it was nothing serious.

The NHS is brilliant given its background and structure. There are three problems though:

-it is run by politicians but whenever anything goes wrong they disappear and hang out senior managers to dry. The latter know this so this influences who will apply for these jobs;
-some of the customers, ie patients. With a perceived free good people react differently to given situations. Charging for no shows with appropriate means testing would solve this; and
-some of the staff. Lots of us work in a world where we can get sacked and we tend to change career direction or at least projects from time to time. Not so in the NHS and this affects the attitude of a small proportion of the staff. This can be caustic and managers often spend their time managing a very small number of staff in this context.

Most of the current problems come from an unwillingness to invest in proper primary care policies and the belief that more GPs solve this problem. It does not as care pathways have changed but the NHS still recruits to 20-30 year old policies. Telling people who turn up to A&E that they are in the wrong place is not the answer. It is not their problem it is yours and your market - ie patients - is telling you that you are running your business inappropriately.

midlifecrisis said:

Whilst I am completely in favour of universal and free (ie paid through taxes) health care, I think there's too much emphasis on Doctors and Nurses being 'heroes' . Yes they do a great job in stitching us up when we've been unfortunate or idiotic but let's not forget that the UK's most prolific murder was a Doctor (250) and in Germany a nurse killed 90!

Granted they were exceptions rather than the rule and the vast majority do a great job. My argument is that they are paid to do a job much like the rest of us. I'd rather praise the man who unclogs the sewers in London or any other city. He probably gets paid a lot less than any trainee nurse and is in sh!t up to his ankles ever day. Be thankful to them as well.

I think the best picture highlighting our double standards and generalisation of society was published by the countryside alliance. Again not a belief I support but it does make you think.

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Trust me- the general population will regret this sort of attitude in years to come. The morale in the NHS is rock bottom. The pay of junior doctors is appauling- you would be suprised to know the true figures- and as a consequence the quality of people entering is diminishing.

Just ask yourself- when someone is responsible for looking after you, your parents or your family - do you want them to be well qualified, treat you with respect and paid appropriately ( not excessively).
Most would say yes.
Be careful what you wish for as a field change is coming in the NHS.

Re: waste unclogger- I would be gobsmacked if they were paid less than a trainee nurse. Who do you think gets paid more- a) a tube driver b) a senior Registrar in heart surgery with 3 degrees and 15 years experience who is rountinely stopping people from bleeding to death when they should often be asleep. - if you chose b you are wrong in most cases.

Having worked in the NHS for nearly 30 years there's lots I could comment on.
Yes there are numerous problems and I think bigbob has highlighted three key issues.....did you know the average tenure for an NHS CEO is 18 months....kind of says it all.
Having said that the NHS is the envy of the world. No other country has such a comprehensive service that is free. The Commonweath Fund, and others, continually evaluate health economies and the NHS is considered the best value Heath System in the world, looking at outcomes for what it costs.

midlifecrisis said:

Whilst I am completely in favour of universal and free (ie paid through taxes) health care, I think there's too much emphasis on Doctors and Nurses being 'heroes' . Yes they do a great job in stitching us up when we've been unfortunate or idiotic but let's not forget that the UK's most prolific murder was a Doctor (250) and in Germany a nurse killed 90!

Granted they were exceptions rather than the rule and the vast majority do a great job. My argument is that they are paid to do a job much like the rest of us. I'd rather praise the man who unclogs the sewers in London or any other city. He probably gets paid a lot less than any trainee nurse and is in sh!t up to his ankles ever day. Be thankful to them as well.

I think the best picture highlighting our double standards and generalisation of society was published by the countryside alliance. Again not a belief I support but it does make you think.

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I'm sure as with all professions there is good and bad but I can only go on what I've seen and experienced..... When my wife had Leukemia it opened my eyes to just how hard they work, the hours they did........Put other so called heroes in their place (sports heroes!!!!!) and they wouldn't know what hit them. Makes me laugh when I hear football players getting millions cant play 3 games a week as they are too tired......Ah bless them.....All I know is that if it wasn't for the commitment of the nurses and doctors on her ward my wife wouldn't be with me now.....Its a calling being a nurse as for me they certainly don't get paid enough.

iainw said:

Trust me- the general population will regret this sort of attitude in years to come. The morale in the NHS is rock bottom. The pay of junior doctors is appauling- you would be suprised to know the true figures- and as a consequence the quality of people entering is diminishing.

Just ask yourself- when someone is responsible for looking after you, your parents or your family - do you want them to be well qualified, treat you with respect and paid appropriately ( not excessively).
Most would say yes.
Be careful what you wish for as a field change is coming in the NHS.

Re: waste unclogger- I would be gobsmacked if they were paid less than a trainee nurse. Who do you think gets paid more- a) a tube driver b) a senior Registrar in heart surgery with 3 degrees and 15 years experience who is rountinely stopping people from bleeding to death when they should often be asleep. - if you chose b you are wrong in most cases.

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There was a program on Tv a few years ago about a certain large plumbing company in London (Pimlico Plumbers) and the wage structure of said co, to cut a long story short, the ones who were paid the most were the drain cleaners, in the region of 150k/pa. I'm sure student nurses would be delighted with that.

jasst said:

There was a program on Tv a few years ago about a certain large plumbing company in London (Pimlico Plumbers) and the wage structure of said co, to cut a long story short, the ones who were paid the most were the drain cleaners, in the region of 150k/pa. I'm sure student nurses would be delighted with that.

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Thankyou for an evidenced based reply. Others just believe the shite politicians spout to deprofessionalise individuals they are fundamentally jealous of ..as they have(had) the public support.
I am sure the majority of NHS Consultant Trauma, Brain and Heart Surgeons would be delighted if their salary was doubled to that of a Pimlico drain cleaner.

My GF is a NHS Consultant and I worked out her hourly rate is equivalent to about £43k pa for a 39 hour working week.

Of course like most Dr's a 39 hour week is what dreams are made of. She is due back at eight and after dinner she will spend another three hours on system one writing up clinic letters and notes.

So apart from eating together some nights we only have time together at weekends which are frequently interpreted with calls, re validation (thanks Shipman) or writing up supervision notes for Jr Dr on special interest sessions.

I have it easy in comparison.

jasst said:

There was a program on Tv a few years ago about a certain large plumbing company in London (Pimlico Plumbers) and the wage structure of said co, to cut a long story short, the ones who were paid the most were the drain cleaners, in the region of 150k/pa. I'm sure student nurses would be delighted with that.

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Apologies for introducing thread drift into a serious and emotive thread - but did anyone else watch the programme on last night about Inside Bentley, and the launch of the Bentayga? The owner of Pimlico Plumbers is a multi-millionaire and owns several Bentley’s...

I believe many nurses and doctors are underpaid for what they do compared to many other professions. However some of that is because the effing trade unions have elevated the salary of some jobs (tube driver is a case in point) to levels I can’t understand... it’s also symptomatic of the unwillingness of the British people (and the government) to invest sufficiently in public services (and bear the tax consequences).

Saw some of that programme but turned off as it was so chavey.

Re Gov spending... we always seem to have money to buy bombs to drop in pointless conflicts.

safrane said:

Saw some of that programme but turned off as it was so chavey.

Re Gov spending... we always seem to have money to buy bombs to drop in pointless conflicts.

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And 13% pay rises for politicians who have never had a real job.
Animal Farm anyone?

My knee op went great thanks to all those hard working Nash staff.

I saw the Bentley programme too, I won't comment on what I thought of that plumber chap!!

Dave