3200 Window judder!

ph646

New Member
Messages
10
Hi all

I wonder if anyone has encountered this problem before?

When the driver's window on my 3200GT is almost closed, it judders. That is to say, it reaches about 30mm from fully closed, stops violently, drops about 10mm and tries to close again. It repeatedly does this, a few times per second until I release the Up Button. It then parks itself about 30mm from closed.

This happens with the door open or closed !

All was well last week. The window performed as it should. When you opened the door, the window would drop by about 15mm and close again after closing the door.

Any suggestions would be welcome before I get deep into the wiring diagrams.

Best regards

Paul
92910
 

Chimaera500

Member
Messages
189
I'm in the middle of renewing all of this on my Gransport which I think has pretty much the same setup as your car. Mine had a failed microswitch on the outside door handle which prevented the window dropping at all. I have taken the opportunity to fix ALL of the potential issues whilst its apart!

From what you describe, I would hazard a guess that your problem might not be electrical.

My basic understanding of how the system works is as follows:

Microswitch on the outside door handle. When you lift the door handle by a mm or so, this triggers the window to drop a couple of CM.
A second microswitch then closes to stop the window dropping any further. You can adjust this switch to set the amount of drop required.
Third microswitch on the inside door handle. Does the same thing as the outside switch- drops the window a couple of CM to allow the door to open.
Several more microswitches present in the door lock module, but this wont be your issue if the door is otherwise opening and closing OK, and you can lock/ set alarm.

The window switches that you use to lower and raise the windows fully override all of the other switches mentioned above. If its getting stuck or struggling to raise, it shouldn't be caused by any of the microswitches inside the door. As your window is juddering, you have an obstruction or mechanical issue with the regulator itself. I suspect that either the welds have failed that hold the gear track to the regulator, or the teeth on the gear track have worn away in the area that is used to drop and raise the window a little (as this area gets used every time the door opens)

This post will help to see what may be going on inside your door.

Only real way to tell will be to take the door card off and to get the regulator out for a closer look. If you do this, its a good idea to get the gear track welded and replace the drop microswitch ( I have loads if you want me to send you a couple) Both easy jobs with the regulator out of the car.

Im also fitting a pair of these to make sure mine are 100% going forward.


New regulators cost loads! (£1k) But the good news is that most can be repaired with a bit of time and a few quid for welding/ new switches.

Give me a shout if you get stuck! Have been through all this very recently so may be able to help further.
 

allandwf

Member
Messages
10,958
Are these windows smart enough to not close if a child had their fingers or head in the gap? Or are they pre those type? Maybe just all needing lubricating etc.
 

j s pollo

Member
Messages
162
Sounds like worn teeth on the window mech if so teeth can be welded and filed down the only way to find out what the problem is you will have to remove the inner door panel run window up and down and check for worn teeth
 

ph646

New Member
Messages
10
Fantastic. I love this forum!

Thank you for all that information. I already have the door card off and the microswitch exposed, which seems to be ok. I'll get back to it over the next few days and report back to you. Hopefully you are correct about the mechanism as it seems to be an easier fix and something we will all have to do at some point in the future.

Thanks again

Paul
 

davy83

Member
Messages
2,809
I ran into something similar about 11-12 years ago on my 3200. I think what you have is the window motor main gear wheel has worn teeth. It might be the contact switches and thats worth a try. However the window drive motor on the 3200 is a weak point. The 4200 motors are better as they use an Aluminium gear wheel. The 3200 has like a sort of hard nylon gear wheel and it wears away and eventually starts skipping the teeth. it wears especially around the top of the movement because its constantly going up and down that little bit when the door opens.
you have to pull the door assembly apart to get into the motors. I managed to get a pair of 4200 motors and made a frankenmotor out of the old 3200 one and the new 4200 one and replaced both of mine with these hybrid motors and touch wood its been perfect ever since.
If you pull the motor out and take the covers off you will see the worn gear if that's the issue. I may still have bits of the old motors with the worn gears I will see if I can post some photos.
The breakers will have parts and I think perhaps the replacement motors are still available, try Eurospares.
 

j s pollo

Member
Messages
162
This picture may help teeth wear on half moon plate if my memory seves me right its the left side when the window is up can be welded and filed to shape and while the unit is off re enforce the welding of the half moon plate like i have they have a bad habit of falling off rubbish Maserati weld.

This is my spare drivers side window mech and hard to get hold of so sorry not for sale also check the drive on the motor but my bet is with the plate.



93004
 

rs48635

Member
Messages
3,181
is it worth also doing the re-learn for easy entry / windows drop?
For certain the seat thing can be fixed using this.
My own 3200 does occasionally forget to close fully. Batteryy disconnect to reset, then lock / unlock a few times I think.
 

ph646

New Member
Messages
10
Happy New Year to all.
I managed to get some time to strip out the window mechanism. You are all correct. It appears to be worn components. The last tooth is worn and the central pivot point, the one with the 6 square notches, has a lot of lateral movement that prevents the motor's gear wheel from mating fully with the quadrant.
Strangely the rotary spring is missing entirely! I assumed I was wrong and searched the inside of the door for it, but no, there is no spring. I have ordered an Alfa Romeo mechanism from ebay and I'll use that spring.
I may make up a steel spring holder without the 6 square dimples and just weld its mating part. Would that be ok?
I'll keep you posted. Thanks95018950199502095021
 

Boomerang_GT

Member
Messages
202
Had this repaired twice last year. Once the wrong and once the right way.
The first time I aligned the plates so they had tight contact and slammed the alloy tooth with a nut. But it came loose again after some weeks.
The second time I used a 10t press and a big screw to press the alloy from inside of the tooth away to the outside so there is pressure from the alloy of the tooth to the two metal plates.
Sorry if this sounds weird, but English is not my mother tongue.
The last way seems to last now.
 

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j s pollo

Member
Messages
162
Hi .For your spring to go missing it looks like the previous owner has had the unit out in the past and forgot to replace the spring contact Dave Askew 01455 202325 he will send you a spring .
also you can buy on flea bay the above splined pin for around £30.00 made in the US if you get stuck there is a mention of this part some where on this forum but give dave a ring he should be able to help you out with the bits you require .
 

Chimaera500

Member
Messages
189
I fitted a pair of these replacement splines to my regulators. Easy install and much better quality than the originals being made from stainless steel.

The spring puts a great deal more pressure on the teeth when the window is lowered. Make sure that the teeth are absolutely free from wear before re fitting a spring. Otherwise you may find it jumps teeth at certain spots. I have a feeling that this is the reason why springs are sometimes removed. The window will still raise and lower perfectly well without it, just a little more work for the motor to do.
 

ph646

New Member
Messages
10
Hi all. I started this thread some time ago and wanted to thank everyone for their help.
I resolved the issue by making 2 new stainless steel pins on a lathe and welding them in place. The issue was just the worn aluminium pins. The teeth were all ok. I added a strengthening weld to the quadrant for good measure. I was lucky to have a lathe at my disposal but would highly recommend the CNC made, stainless pins mentioned above, as the would be an easy repair.
I repaired the passenger side window too, for good measure and also swapped the motor to one sourced from an Alfa 916 GTV. Mine had suffered from water ingress and was running very slowly and noisily.
Thanks again
 

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