Alfa 147 issue

[CatmanV2]

Afternoon, all. For the first time I've managed to make a car worse

Mrs C's 147 has an electric hatch release only (2002) which has been becoming increasingly un-reliable.
Our respect indy was sure it was the solenoid, but they don't make these any more, and when it fires it fires well, so I was less convinced. Decided to have a poke today.

So lock unit out, 12v on it fires perfectly every time.
Press the remote button with the lock disconnected, and you get 12v on the wire.
Press the remote with lock disconnected, and nada.

Now I can hear a relay under the dash clicking when you press the button, so my next thought is that this is failing somehow. It's not listed in the diagram and it's. none of the visible ones on the fuseboard.

Poking around I can feel something clicking hidden behind the fuseboard but no way can I see it / get to it so I thought I'd see if I can move the fuse board. All the plugs off, allen bolts out, still not budging. Think: This is getting too far, so put it all back together.

Now she won't start. Turns over fine. First time she fired, ran for about 10 seconds, and then petered out and died.

Done a battery reset. Got the booster pack on it right now.

What idiocy have I done?

C

 

[Oneball]

I’m sure my 2001 147 had remote release for the hatch. Any way but irrelevant.

If I’ve got this right it sounds like you’re saying the remote boot works but the central locking doesn’t?

If so I think it might be something to do with the car thinking the boot is open rather than the solenoid or relay. If the immobiliser works on the fuel pump that might explain starting too or find the fuel pump relay or fuse you may have knocked it.

 

[CatmanV2]

I’m sure my 2001 147 had remote release for the hatch. Any way but irrelevant.

Well it has a button on the dash and one on the key if that's what you mean by 'remote' Neither work at all reliably. The key button always flashes the indicators as expected.

If I’ve got this right it sounds like you’re saying the remote boot works but the central locking doesn’t?

Nope. Sorry. Central locking is fine. Boot release not at all.

Will check the fuel pump fuse properly. All the obvious ones are good. Cheers

C

 

[lifes2short]

can't help sorry but good luck with telling the wife you've well and truly buggered her car

 

[Trev Latter]

Might sound a bit daft, but are you checking the feed to the boot solenoid with the hatch shut? First thing to go on most cars is the wiring loom between the body and hatch. Maybe there’s a broken wire in there somewhere making contact when the boots open?

 

[Oneball]

This is the bit I don’t understand

“Press the remote button with the lock disconnected, and you get 12v on the wire.
Press the remote with lock disconnected, and nada.”

If you’ve added an extra “dis” then it makes sense as some systems use the solenoid itself as the open sensor.

 

[CatmanV2]

can't help sorry but good luck with telling the wife you've well and truly buggered her car

She knows! To be fair, this is something of a first! (and last?)

C

 

[CatmanV2]

Might sound a bit daft, but are you checking the feed to the boot solenoid with the hatch shut? First thing to go on most cars is the wiring loom between the body and hatch. Maybe there’s a broken wire in there somewhere making contact when the boots open?

Nope, but that loom issue was exactly my thought. So I spliced in before the hinge which is where I was testing. Just not enough oomph to open the solenoid.

C

 

[Oishi]

For the first time I've managed to make a car worse

I wish I could say that. The first time part anyway. I seem to booger up something everytime I try to fix something. Good luck on the repair, and BTW, I have been unable to find the info about the Skyhook system I referred to in the 4200 post. I have slogged thru a bunch of SAE papers on the Skyhook algorithm with no success. I will keep looking, but for now I am forced to admit that I may have reposted anecdotal info. Thanks for calling it out. The quality of info on our site depends on peer review of what is said. Ed.

 

[CatmanV2]

I wish I could say that. The first time part anyway. I seem to booger up something everytime I try to fix something. Good luck on the repair, and BTW, I have been unable to find the info about the Skyhook system I referred to in the 4200 post. I have slogged thru a bunch of SAE papers on the Skyhook algorithm with no success. I will keep looking, but for now I am forced to admit that I may have reposted anecdotal info. Thanks for calling it out. The quality of info on our site depends on peer review of what is said. Ed.

No biggie dude. I'm more often wrong than I'm right. Which is nice as it gives me so many more opportunities to learn

C

 

[lifes2short]

this is something of a first! (and last?)

C

that she knows

 

[CatmanV2]

that she knows

That I'm allowed to work on her car
C

 

[CatmanV2]

This is the bit I don’t understand

“Press the remote button with the lock disconnected, and you get 12v on the wire.
Press the remote with lock disconnected, and nada.”

If you’ve added an extra “dis” then it makes sense as some systems use the solenoid itself as the open sensor.

So I'm measuring for 12v on the trigger for the solenoid. If I disconnect the solenoid, the wire goes 12v as I'd expect (when I press the button). If I connect the solenoid the tester continues to state it's at neutral. I guess this might be correct if there's enough voltage drop across the solendoid, I could stick a proper meter on it tomorrow.

Solenoid still won't open so feels like there's too much of a drop for something

Solenoid works fine when 12v applied.

So
Internal release button: Works rarely
Keyfob release button: Works rarely. Flashes indicators every time
12v to solenoid: Works every time

C

 

[Oneball]

How many wires go to the solenoid?

Could it be that there is a micro switch within the solenoid that feeds back to the ecu and its faulty so the ecu thinks it’s locked when it’s connected and doesn’t send 12v to the solenoid

 

[lifes2short]

tend to agree with oneball as a possible cause, have you tried googling the problem or you tube, took me about 3 days of off and on googling a problem I had with my X5 last year and eventually found one fella on YouTube nailed the problem to a £50 part

 

[philw696]

Chris,
Can you hear the fuel pump prime ?
My guess is you have disturbed the relay or a fuse has popped.
That's the area I would be looking in to get the car to start.

 

[CatmanV2]

Chris,
Can you hear the fuel pump prime ?
My guess is you have disturbed the relay or a fuse has popped.
That's the area I would be looking in to get the car to start.

I think so. I pulled the fuel pump fuse and checked it with a meter, but it's under the bonnet, not the panel I was messing with. When I pushed it back in there was a whine under the bonnet. I don't actually know where the pumps are on these?

It does feel like pump though, given the way it died.

C

 

[philw696]

I think so. I pulled the fuel pump fuse and checked it with a meter, but it's under the bonnet, not the panel I was messing with. When I pushed it back in there was a whine under the bonnet. I don't actually know where the pumps are on these?

It does feel like pump though, given the way it died.

C

My guess is the pump is in the tank.
Lift the rear seat base and see if there is a removable panel.
Check the feeds there.
If all okay a light tap might bring it back to life to see if she will start.

 

[CatmanV2]

My guess is the pump is in the tank.
Lift the rear seat base and see if there is a removable panel.
Check the feeds there.
If all okay a light tap might bring it back to life to see if she will start.

Needs a new battery first. It's been leaking....

I've got an expert on the case as well.

C

 

[CatmanV2]

....and yes, it's in the tank

C