Anyone had the jab yet?

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lozcb

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Well my test to release 8th day PWR test came back negative today so im free to travel and go shopping , and I ought to get in touch with the surgery to get mine under way , i think we are all phizer down this way ................lets hope it makes me less grumpy eh Wanderer :whistle: what are the chances
 

philw696

Member
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25,113
Well my test to release 8th day PWR test came back negative today so im free to travel and go shopping , and I ought to get in touch with the surgery to get mine under way , i think we are all phizer down this way ................lets hope it makes me less grumpy eh Wanderer :whistle: what are the chances
Loz,
I have heard people taking the Phizer vaccine end up buying electric suv's mate.
 

RoaryRati

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A 58 yo fit friend of mine was in intensive care with Covid last April. Six months later he still had chest pains - turns out he had two blocked arteries ie an unknown underlying health condition and possibly heading for a heart attack - this probably explains why he was so poorly. Turns out also heart issues run in his family. He's doing fine now, albeit slowly.
 

bigbob

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8,952
Cheers mate Ms French not sure and I know lots of people here refusing the AZ vaccine.
Will ask questions on Monday as we both feel healthy but without a vaccine passport we won't be able to travel in the future.
The French do seem to have taken against the AZ vaccine, strange as AZ is run by a Frenchman.

A number of people here have given Wattie a kicking for simply pointing out what a lot of health professionals have mentioned - Covid risk falls rapidly with age so for very young people vaccine risk may be at parity. Very few of us are young enough to bother to think about that but it’s an issue which many of our children will be thinking through whatever they tell us in conversation.

A thought for anyone healthy as we come into summer. If you don’t go out a lot and don’t have the mistaken belief that many have about going to Spain etc this summer then go and dig into new vaccines that are coming. Look at how much research/clinical trials many of these have had, are they single dose and ask if they - and indeed AZ2 etc - are targeting newer variants? For those over 60 it was a no brainer to get jabbed as soon as offered, ditto for those who are younger with serious health issues but for other people waiting might give a better health outcome especially as AZ1 is at the lower end of the performance stats which is hardly surprising for a low tech, easily delivery phase 1 response. Still glad that it exists as it’s a game changer.

We all shop around for cars so when there are a dozen vaccines available in six months time some element of consumer choice would be nice. This is hard to deliver with a state run ‘free’ health system but it will be interesting to see what choices people make in other systems which are more demand driven.

I agree vaccine passports are coming whatever those adverse to identity cards say so we will need to get them to travel. I travel a lot through Dubai as a hub and can easily see how European countries can have everything in place to vaccinate people and issue Covid passports but lots of less developed countries are going to struggle to deliver this. Airline travel is going to be strange for quite a long time.
 
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Wattie

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The French do seem to have taken against the AZ vaccine, strange as AZ is run by a Frenchman.

A number of people here have given Wattie a kicking for simply pointing out what a lot of health professionals have mentioned - Covid risk falls rapidly with age so for very young people vaccine risk may be at parity. Very few of us are young enough to bother to think about that but it’s an issue which many of our children will be thinking through whatever they tell us in conversation.

A thought for anyone healthy as we come into summer. If you don’t go out a lot and don’t have the mistaken belief that many have about going to Spain etc this summer then go and dig into new vaccines that are coming. Look at how much research/clinical trials many of these have had, are they single dose and ask if they - and indeed AZ2 etc - are targeting newer variants? For those over 60 it was a no brainer to get jabbed as soon as offered, ditto for those who are younger with serious health issues but for other people waiting might give a better health outcome especially as AZ1 is at the lower end of the performance stats which is hardly surprising for a low tech, easily delivery phase 1 response. Still glad that it exists as it’s a game changer.

We all shop around for cars so when there are a dozen vaccines available in six months time some element of consumer choice would be nice. This is hard to deliver with a state run ‘free’ health system but it will be interesting to see what choices people make in other systems which are more demand driven.

I agree vaccine passports are coming whatever those adverse to identity cards say so we will need to get them to travel. I travel a lot through Dubai as a hub and can easily see how European countries can have everything in place to vaccinate people and issue Covid passports but lots of less developed countries are going to struggle to deliver this. Airline travel is going to be strange for quite a long time.
Cheers, appreciated.
 

bigbob

Member
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Cheers, appreciated.
No probs Wattie. You do have a strange way of communicating at times and do wind people up but I suspect you are well aware of both. However, there are sometimes nice nuggets in your posts that are worth digging for and I desperately want to know what you have in that huge safe next to your bed....or maybe I don’t.
 

Wattie

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8,640
No probs Wattie. You do have a strange way of communicating at times and do wind people up but I suspect you are well aware of both. However, there are sometimes nice nuggets in your posts that are worth digging for and I desperately want to know what you have in that huge safe next to your bed....or maybe I don’t.
BigBob I feel compelled to have to point out an obvious error......”there are always nice nuggets in”......
Fixed it for you.
 

MarkMas

Chief pedant
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8,795
The French do seem to have taken against the AZ vaccine, strange as AZ is run by a Frenchman.

A number of people here have given Wattie a kicking for simply pointing out what a lot of health professionals have mentioned - Covid risk falls rapidly with age so for very young people vaccine risk may be at parity. Very few of us are young enough to bother to think about that but it’s an issue which many of our children will be thinking through whatever they tell us in conversation.

A thought for anyone healthy as we come into summer. If you don’t go out a lot and don’t have the mistaken belief that many have about going to Spain etc this summer then go and dig into new vaccines that are coming. Look at how much research/clinical trials many of these have had, are they single dose and ask if they - and indeed AZ2 etc - are targeting newer variants? For those over 60 it was a no brainer to get jabbed as soon as offered, ditto for those who are younger with serious health issues but for other people waiting might give a better health outcome especially as AZ1 is at the lower end of the performance stats which is hardly surprising for a low tech, easily delivery phase 1 response. Still glad that it exists as it’s a game changer.

We all shop around for cars so when there are a dozen vaccines available in six months time some element of consumer choice would be nice. This is hard to deliver with a state run ‘free’ health system but it will be interesting to see what choices people make in other systems which are more demand driven.

I agree vaccine passports are coming whatever those adverse to identity cards say so we will need to get them to travel. I travel a lot through Dubai as a hub and can easily see how European countries can have everything in place to vaccinate people and issue Covid passports but lots of less developed countries are going to struggle to deliver this. Airline travel is going to be strange for quite a long time.

Some of the various vaccines are quite different in how they work, and how they need to be stored, but they seem to have very similar outcomes (seems to me that 92% effectiveness and 96% effectiveness is near enough the same thing for something like this). I'm with Dr Faucci - when he was asked which was the best vaccine, he said, 'The one you are offered soonest'.

84030

And, yes the value / risk to an individual in taking the vaccine does vary (a bit) with the risk-factors of that individual. So if you are in a group more likely to be exposed (nurses, shopkeepers) or in a group more likely to have serious outcome (older, fatter, sicker) then the risk:benefit calculation changes for an individual. (But not by much as the vaccines are very safe and the harms are unevenly distributed.)

BUT as well as protecting yourself, one point of vaccines is for enough people to take them to protect the population at large (as I have said). While the ideal personal model is for everyone else to have a vaccination and you not to have one, the ideal population model is for you to join in with everyone else to have the vaccination. All (both) my children (in their 20s) have thought this through, and tell me in conversation that they think the right thing to do (as with MMR, polio, etc) is to get the vaccination, primarily to protect others.

Also, the evidence seems to suggest that the risks in taking the vaccine are so low, that everyone might as well have it, if only to avoid the argument about whether they are public-spirited or selfish. Indeed on present evidence, the (tiny) risk of injury or death from going to get vaccinated seems to be significantly higher due to the journey itself, rather than the vaccine, which suggests that you should aim to get the vaccine at your nearest venue (as well as your soonest opportunity). A bit like only buying a ticket for the Saturday lottery after Thursday morning, so your risk of winning is higher than your risk of dying between the purchase and the draw.
 

Blox

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My kids have thought this through too, one of whom is directly impacted by vaccine injury since he was 4 years old. So please don’t tell me that I’m being ‘selfish’ and patronise me in such a way. I have not saught here or elsewhere to colonise others to my point of view. I simply reflect in my comments that to be vaccinated or not is a personal choice and should be respected either way.
 

MarkMas

Chief pedant
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8,795
My kids have thought this through too, one of whom is directly impacted by vaccine injury since he was 4 years old. So please don’t tell me that I’m being ‘selfish’ and patronise me in such a way. I have not saught here or elsewhere to colonise others to my point of view. I simply reflect in my comments that to be vaccinated or not is a personal choice and should be respected either way.

I really don't mean to patronise anyone or disrespect their personal experiences. I support the idea that being vaccinated is a personal choice, but what I am saying is that for someone to make that personal choice does not just have personal impact but has population impact too. So it is literally 'public-spirited' or literally 'selfish' based on the personal choice that you make; whether the reasons to be 'selfish' are very good (I'm imuno-compromised and would die) or very weak (I can't be arsed to go to the medical centre), and whether they are founded in data, experience or misinformation.

Blood donation is a similar example - to donate blood is personally disadvantageous but good for the population. For a healthy person to donate blood is 'public-spirited', and not to do so is 'selfish'. I don't donate blood - and I admit that this is for purely selfish reasons.

BUT I am unrepentant in trying to get people to accept the point of view that getting vaccinations is generally a good thing to do. If it is not compulsory, then persuasion to 'my point of view' is exactly what is needed - otherwise how do we get the population vaccinated, in order to protect people? If such attempts at persuasion bothers people, and even if it is upsetting to people with good personal reasons not to be vaccinated, it still seems to me to be appropriate, in general.

Someone should be trying to persuade me to give blood; such behaviour would not be 'patronising' or 'colonising', just embarrassing and irritating for me to be put on the spot and forced to re-consider my choice, and maybe change my mind.
 

Blox

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That only makes sense if you take the view that the whole population needs to be vaccinated to achieve herd immunity and thereby prevent excess deaths from a virus with a 99.7% survival rate.

I agree (and mentioned previously) that vaccines have been effective and should be taken up by those in vulnerable age groups and/or who have underlying health issues. But the rest of us should be left to acquire naturally immunity as the virus becomes endemic. Basically, once those that are at risk are protected, let the rest of us get on with our lives and make our own choices, as we do in other areas of health, wellbeing and social interaction. Sweden is a good example of this approach.

I assume you would support flu vaccines for all too based on your point of view ? Vaccinating everyone for everything regardless, on an annual basis with top up jabs in between ? Those top up jabs by the way already having been excused the rigour of a testing regime.

According to latest media reports, the UK should achieve herd immunity next week in any case. So we should be in good shape if the vaccines are as effective as they are reported to be, and we shouldn’t see any 3rd wave in terms of excess deaths.

As an aside, it interests me greatly that there has been so little coverage throughout the pandemic about how we can all protect ourselves in other ways, through diet, exercise, supplements, etc. Basically, optimising our own highly effective immune systems. If the Government approach was really all about saving lives, surely there should be a more holistic approach to public health.
 

safrane

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Not sure you last para is the view of the Gov esp after their last joke waste of money Pig Out to Help Out scheme.
 
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Zep

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9,110
It strikes me that people find there own truth in this situation.

Blox’s experience is of an injury caused by a vaccine and he has very reasonably formed his view around this.

My experience is of the loss of a cousin who, with no co-morbidities, contracted Covid in the early days, gave it to his mother, and they both died, leaving another cousin without a mother or brother. This also happened to a colleague of mine who pulled through after 5 weeks in ITU, but woke up to discover that he had passed it to his mother who had died. This means that I am pro-vaccine, on the basis that I wouldn’t wish what happened to my family on anyone.

People should make their own choices and take as much care as they can to avoid catching this grim disease in whatever way they see fit.

There is little point arguing the toss, people will find their own way regardless, and we should respect those choices.
 

Blox

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Absolutely !

Sorry to hear about your own personal experience and losing family from this is just terrible.

But I totally agree with your assessment. Spot on.
 
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Zep

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Absolutely !

Sorry to hear about your own personal experience and losing family from this is just terrible.

But I totally agree with your assessment. Spot on.

Thank you. We are getting there.
 

conaero

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Being over 50 I have been trying all week to book my jab but the system keeps erroring. Phoned up twice and been told there is an IT error and to keep tying.

BS I think and short on vaccines I feel
 
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