Brexit Deal

spkennyuk

Member
Messages
5,930
No argument intended.

As stated i was curious as to how the Tax VP had come up with the figure considering the still unknown amount of duty if any at all from the temp tariffs.

Whats apparent is that its a headline figure they are quoting without the detailed numbers to back it up.

What your saying is its a figure between zero and 120 million. The 120 million based on WTO at current levels which wont apply for at least 12 months.

If it was a QI question the only answer would be "nobody knows"

Lets face it would be to the benefit of business in the UK's if we knew what the temp rate were going to be. I am sure the temp tarrifs are being used as leverage in the attempts to get a Brexit deal over the line which is why they are not being published earlier.

The uncertainty is doing so much damage to business as the ability to plan ahead is being hindered so much. Couple that with the effect Covid has had on the world economy. Its not a sustainable position for a lot of companies to be in.

I honestly hope it costs a lot less than anticipated for yourself and the many other businesses that will be affected. Hopefully some of those costs can be passed along to reduce direct costs to companies.
 

rivarama

Member
Messages
1,102
You paint a picture that is very familiar to me from the work I am doing at the moment. The uncertainty is crippling as we usually plan years ahead and we are facing a situation where we don’t know our costs in 3 months time. I imagine you are like us, we have factories which aren’t moving so alternative sources are not an option even if the U.K. is the biggest market.

I voted remain based on this scenario, but have no desire to change the outcome. But would prefer to have more clarity. Simply removing tariffs for a short period has other consequences including a potential flood of cheap products from other sources due to WTO MFN rules. The number of potential outcomes and the variation between them is mind boggling, extremely challenging, and none are net positive. It is what it is I guess.

Yup!

Again - I do accept the predicament we find ourselves in, this is called democracy. But I think we should be honest about the fall out financially. It might be huge, even if again, people didn’t care so much about that when they casted their rightful votes.
 

Wattie

Member
Messages
8,640
I wouldn’t be concerned about the financial fallout.
That can be simply be printed from thin air along with everything else.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
We import a bit of kit from Europe, and calculated that if no deal is done, and we revert to WTO terms, that bit of kit costs us 43% more to buy!
Not to mentioned working out what tariffs you have to pay! That took almost a day in itself!

So we either take a reduced margin at what we sell it for. Or the prices go up accordingly.

No winners there!
 

allandwf

Member
Messages
10,958
We import a bit of kit from Europe, and calculated that if no deal is done, and we revert to WTO terms, that bit of kit costs us 43% more to buy!
Not to mentioned working out what tariffs you have to pay! That took almost a day in itself!

So we either take a reduced margin at what we sell it for. Or the prices go up accordingly.

No winners there!
Maybe someone will pick up on it, and manufacture said bit of kit here? Who knows, it will be the transition period that will be the problem.
 

spkennyuk

Member
Messages
5,930
We import a bit of kit from Europe, and calculated that if no deal is done, and we revert to WTO terms, that bit of kit costs us 43% more to buy!
Not to mentioned working out what tariffs you have to pay! That took almost a day in itself!

So we either take a reduced margin at what we sell it for. Or the prices go up accordingly.

No winners there!

43% ? what duty rate were you using to come up with that figure the average rate of duty is somewhere around 3.5 to 5.5% unless the kit is something with a very high duty rate and you cant claim vat back on import for some reason it shouldnt be anywhere near 43% more under WTO.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
43% ? what duty rate were you using to come up with that figure the average rate of duty is somewhere around 3.5 to 5.5% unless the kit is something with a very high duty rate and you cant claim vat back on import for some reason it shouldnt be anywhere near 43% more under WTO.

Electronics under WTO come in for all sorts of weird tariffs.
 

GeoffCapes

Member
Messages
14,000
Maybe someone will pick up on it, and manufacture said bit of kit here? Who knows, it will be the transition period that will be the problem.

That's what we've had to do. At a cost of several ££££££'s

But that in itself comes with challenges. Without getting into specifics, the usual tooling for manufacture, sourcing components from outside Europe etc.
It's a ball ache. Fortunately someone else's ball ache.

If the same kit can be replicated in the UK for a similar cost then we should be ok. Last time I checked it is costing around 8-10% more.
Which is bearable. 43% isn't!
 

allandwf

Member
Messages
10,958
That's what we've had to do. At a cost of several ££££££'s

But that in itself comes with challenges. Without getting into specifics, the usual tooling for manufacture, sourcing components from outside Europe etc.
It's a ball ache. Fortunately someone else's ball ache.

If the same kit can be replicated in the UK for a similar cost then we should be ok. Last time I checked it is costing around 8-10% more.
Which is bearable. 43% isn't!
I'm sure it works both ways, unless the UK is not a big market for them.
 

rivarama

Member
Messages
1,102
I wouldn’t be concerned about the financial fallout.
That can be simply be printed from thin air along with everything else.
Go tell that to businesses and individuals... while you’re at it, ask people to dig in their gardens too, they most surely will find gold buried somewhere :)
 

2b1ask1

Special case
Messages
20,220
Have we got a car industry? I thought we had already given it away to the rest of the world? I think F1 is about the biggest UK manufacturer of cars these days... Lotus owned by Proton, LEVC (black cabs) Chinese owned!

According to the AA only 3 companies are UK owned: Morgan, Caterham and McClaren! So Mr BarnDoor is flogging a dead horse again.
 

Nayf

Member
Messages
2,734
Have we got a car industry? I thought we had already given it away to the rest of the world? I think F1 is about the biggest UK manufacturer of cars these days... Lotus owned by Proton, LEVC (black cabs) Chinese owned!

According to the AA only 3 companies are UK owned: Morgan, Caterham and McClaren! So Mr BarnDoor is flogging a dead horse again.
Nissan, Toyota, Honda, Ford, Aston, Lotus, Jaguar, Land Rover et al may well be foreign owned, but the livelihoods of the people who work at UK plants are very much relevant to this discussion. If manufacturing becomes too expensive in the UK, then there will be no manufacturing in the UK, wherever the owner is from...