Using a 4200 as a winter sports car.

paul328

Member
Messages
129
I wonder if anyone has experience here.
I collect old cars and generally keep them off the road from November until early April with occasional drives in dry days when the salt has been washed off the roads, up here near Glasgow. I normally use my everyday 4wd drive saloon or estate cars as year round cars with winter tyres from November to April. My previous job required me to always be at work places on time irrespective of weather. Most years I hardly use the everyday cars during the summer except for very long drives over short periods of time.
I bought a 4200 a year ago and used it very sparingly over last winter. In fairness it was a very wet rather than icy one here. It is my newest classic car, and therefore possibly the best rustproofed.
Has anyone used one as an alternative daily driver over the winter?
If so:
  1. Did they notice any significant deterioration in the body/underbody or components?
  2. Did they put on all season or winter tyres and what difference did they make compared to modern premium tyres like Pilot 4's? if so which ones?
  3. Did the air con de-mist systems cope well?
  4. Any other tips or advice?

All views appreciated.
 

Gooner

Member
Messages
443
About 4 years ago I commuted daily in my Spyder over the winter. 150 mile round trip daily, mainly A roads and motorway. During the day it was parked under cover.

I haven’t noticed any corrosion in the subsequent years.

I didn’t fit winter tyres, didn’t notice any problems at all. On wet/icy days I didn’t put it in Sport, which I normally do.

If your aircon is holding charge for more than a couple of months at a time then you are one up on me :). I found heating/blowers very effective. If the hood had got very wet on the morning journey, then I had to wait a couple of minutes for the misted windows to clear before setting off on the journey home. If the windscreen is iced up you’ll need to scrape it.


I was pleasantly surprised how capable the car was, no real issues at all. These are very well engineered and built cars in the main. Then again, I had previously been commuting in a TVR.
 

Gazcw

Member
Messages
7,699
I wonder if anyone has experience here.
I collect old cars and generally keep them off the road from November until early April with occasional drives in dry days when the salt has been washed off the roads, up here near Glasgow. I normally use my everyday 4wd drive saloon or estate cars as year round cars with winter tyres from November to April. My previous job required me to always be at work places on time irrespective of weather. Most years I hardly use the everyday cars during the summer except for very long drives over short periods of time.
I bought a 4200 a year ago and used it very sparingly over last winter. In fairness it was a very wet rather than icy one here. It is my newest classic car, and therefore possibly the best rustproofed.
Has anyone used one as an alternative daily driver over the winter?
If so:
  1. Did they notice any significant deterioration in the body/underbody or components?
  2. Did they put on all season or winter tyres and what difference did they make compared to modern premium tyres like Pilot 4's? if so which ones?
  3. Did the air con de-mist systems cope well?
  4. Any other tips or advice?
All views appreciated.
Best rustproofed! Are you sure? Subframe eaters. Stonechip and waxoil the **** out of it, but why not. Great plan
 

paul328

Member
Messages
129
Best rustproofed! Are you sure? Subframe eaters. Stonechip and waxoil the **** out of it, but why not. Great plan
At the MOT they noted as they all are told to do 'rust on springs'. During lockdown I went under the car and brushed down anything with surface rust; then rust kill then over painted them. In addition I covered with rustproof overcoating. I was just annoyed at this petty rubbish of a non safety important or structural significance.
That is in part why I am asking. Surface rust.
 

MarkMas

Chief pedant
Messages
8,795
I put winter tyres on my QPV (doing it tomorrow) and feel that it makes a great deal of difference to grip in colder conditions. I use Pirelli Sottozeros, which I love, even though I hate P Zeros as summer tyres.
 
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TimR

Member
Messages
2,656
Front subframes have earned a reputation for rotting out. Not just the 4200s either...
They rot from the inside out. Just cos you can’t see it doesn’t mean it isn’t rotting away quietly IMO. Handbrake cables will suffer. The rear brake discs/ handbrake bell is pretty open to the elements, and the articulated elbows that operate them...Not to mention on my manual car, the entire gear cable control mechanism is totally exposed to all the wet roads can throw at it as it hangs underneath the gearbox.
Personally I believe they are a bit rust prone. Pull the front bumper; I bet your reinforcement bar is powder by now...!
But I’d also concede that they are certainly a reliable car and would probably make a good enough workhorse if it’s a decently maintained example.
Personally, I don’t use mine in bad weather but I also think everyday use has advantages. Salt is a bit of a death nail. Not sure why you’d want to subject unprotected vehicles to the ravages of this but that’s pretty obvious regardless of what it is....
 
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stevepen

Member
Messages
139
Must admit I’m not planning on using mine over winter. I’ve bought a £2k RAV4 which has proved great over the last 3 weeks of constant rain. Will sell it again in the spring for probably the same amount.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
Messages
9,033
Always recall when I first was looking for a 4200 back in 2011.
I looked at a late facelift so was probably only 5 years old, mid 20's mileage.
I was shocked. So rusty underneath, the drain holes in the boot lid had circles of rust. Nearly put me off completely, thought to myself nice looking cars built like an Alfa.
Fact is, that is what they are.
Fortunately after recovering from the disappointment, saw another, that hadn't been used over winter, and was kept undercover, as new.
That is what I bought and still have today.
No way is it going to be exposed to any salty wet roads!
That's the problem with the QP's of a similar age to the 4200.
A saloon car is used more as a daily all year round, and now look at the rusty subframe issues as a result. The GT also.
Can be nice and shiny on top, but have a look underneath.
You would have to rust proof heavy for it to survive.
 

Twinspark

Member
Messages
460
How good is a 4200 as a winter sports car? Pretty terrible I would imagine. You’d have to get the heater matrix replaced if you want reliable heat in the cabin, they are quite tail happy and the airbox is really low in the car which is especially bad in wet conditions over icy ones.
 

paul328

Member
Messages
129
Thanks guys, happy to listen to more input on this. I seem to recall the front wishbones are Aluminium on these cars? It was 6 months ago that i was working on it and the car is parked up just now elsewhere so can't get under and check. I don't recall noticing any surface corrosion on them. It would be odd to rust from the inside unless there is a known bad batch or design defect???
The gear change mechanism on the transaxle is very exposed. I did jack up the car and lubricate that as the gear change was heavy when I bought it.

I was driving a 1979 Bentley T2 most of the summer including the North coast 500, where it drove about 1100 miles. I didn't take the 4200 as no spare wheel. Compared to my Audi A8 designed 50+ years later clearly the T2 is not as robust etc. However it makes me smile and happy, when I drive it.

It is the same idea for the 4200 for winter use. The 4200 makes me smile and happy as do my other old cars. As it is newest of the oldies, I was hoping to use it. I did use my 328GTS a lot as a DD and over winter as per original post, but it suffered. I had the body it completely refurbished, but don't want to do that with the 4200 if there is a significant risk that it is not as robust as say my Passat W8 in rust terms.

I hope this explains my thinking more
 

Spartacus

Member
Messages
3,184
You might get rust under the rear lights if the car is wet , but thats about it for corrosion on a 4200.
 

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,038
I used my 3200 all year around and it wasn't an issue. Just drive to the conditions....but I would worry a bit about rust now they are at this age.
 

Ewan

Member
Messages
6,757
Back when they were current I used my 3200’s and 4200’s as my daily cars, all year round. Other than one particularly snowy trip up a steep hill in the 3200, I had no problems. But whether those individual examples are still in good condition now - who knows!? They certainly got very wet and salty during my use as they lived outside on the streets of London and commuted me back and forth to Dorset, 52 weeks a year.

You’ll be fine to use the 4200, and modern all-weather all-year tyres will suffice. But do keep up with the under body rust proofing.

I trust you are keeping “my” Khamsin off the road this winter!
 

2b1ask1

Special case
Messages
20,220
Drove my 4200 extensively most winters the GS not so much. The most essential thing is winter tyres then as others have pointed out handbrake is open to the elements so expect to be changing them more frequently. Air box is a worry so rip it out and put an oil free K&N up behind the headlight.

subframes are a concern and I’d imagine that is worse in the North.

I have a set of 4200 wheels for my winters as the bigger sidewalls take the bumps better.
 

paul328

Member
Messages
129
Back when they were current I used my 3200’s and 4200’s as my daily cars, all year round. Other than one particularly snowy trip up a steep hill in the 3200, I had no problems. But whether those individual examples are still in good condition now - who knows!? They certainly got very wet and salty during my use as they lived outside on the streets of London and commuted me back and forth to Dorset, 52 weeks a year.

You’ll be fine to use the 4200, and modern all-weather all-year tyres will suffice. But do keep up with the under body rust proofing.

I trust you are keeping “my” Khamsin off the road this winter!
Hi Ewan

thanks for the feedback. Down there you don't get much salt on the roads! lol In Scotland, it is sometimes difficult to tell the difference between salt and snow they put so much down!

In fact I did use the Khamsin from time to time during the winter on good days. I do like to keep an interesting car on the road at winter and drive one of them on Christmas and new years day regardless. I bought the T2 from Silver Lady Service in Bournemouth. According to them, they never have salt down there. You were quite close. Th T2 is in amazing condition underneath for a 41 year old car. All the factory undersea was intact even under the front wheel arch liners. I was quite impressed. Mind you 50% went to North America, so presumably they made an effort compared to early pre 1986 Italian cars which had virtually no rustproofing.

I hope all well with you.

I a thinking of getting a spare set of wheels and using winter tyres on them.
 

paul328

Member
Messages
129
Hi guys
We had our first fall of snow last night. I thought I would take the 4200 out to the shops to buy a car cover for her and to dry her off. I have new Pilot 4's on the back. The back end was 'lively' on the snow and ice. I don't think it would be a good winter car.
I spent a few days under the car when it was at the garage for brakes and other service work. the sub frames showed a bit of surface corrosion. I rubbed prepared and painted them. It is quite an involved job as unless you strip of exhausts and other parts some areas are difficult to access. We were amazed at how solid the car was with no signs of body rust although it is clear that in the past this car spent a lot of time outdoor due to some debris in the drain areas.
So, not a snow and ice car but still an astounding car for the noise and the speed.
i recently bought a 575M F1 which just feels like a bigger version of the 4200, but less well equipped. Why no heated seats? It is quantifiably faster but much more a GT than the GT! By comparison the 4200 feels like an unruly hooligan just waiting to get off the leash.
 

Navcorr

Member
Messages
3,839
Did you try the gearbox in ice mode? If you have a CC?
Have no idea how effective it is - never tried. Just curious.

78550
 

paul328

Member
Messages
129
Hi
No i have a manual car. The MTC was on but seemed to get a fright as i left the house and defaulted until the car started again.