Are you worried yet.

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Silvercat

Silvercat

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Wattie said:
What I’m pointing too is that regardless of whether every adult (on the planet) is vaccinated unless you vaccinate children you are always going to be at risk of catching covid (have they proved that being vaccinated stops onward transmission to others yet?).

This “vaccine” will return us to normal line is therefore a fallacy.

Protecting “public health” isn’t just about covid (which its now what it’s become). It’s about the overall social effects of these political actions on society. The impact this is having on the majority far outweighs the “risk” that this virus has on largely elderly/unhealthy/ underlying health compromised individuals.

There’s no end in sight- for many many years at this rate.
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I agree Wattie...the vaccination programmes are purely a tactical response ( and a partial one at that) to the tsunami of 'unknowns' about this virus. One thing for sure, its most likely to be around certainly as long as most of us are around on this planet, so humanity is going to have to figure out how we deal with it longer term and the evolutionary variants/ mutations which will inevitably come around. Perhaps it will be managed like seasonal flu, without the need to destroy the world economies. I think all Govts are still learning how to respond but sooner or later it will settle down. But we may also have to modify our behaviours and how we live generally to minimise the risks in the future. I suspect the freedoms to travel pretty much anywhere and everywhere may get curtailed for a few years until this becomes background issue. So much for travelling in my retirement!
 
MarkMas

MarkMas

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Wattie said:
....Did you know that the average age of covid deaths in the UK was 82.4? Life expectancy was 81!
In Australia it’s 85, once again higher than the average life expectancy....
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I hate to repeat myself, but this is inaccurate and unhelpful.
Firstly, the life expectancy of the average British male is 89 not 81.
Secondly, that is life expectancy at birth; if you make it to 82 your life expectancy is about 89.
So to suggest that most people who die of COVID should be dead already is, as well as being absurd and callous, factually incorrect.
 
MarkMas

MarkMas

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MarkMas said:
I hate to repeat myself, but this is inaccurate and unhelpful.
Firstly, the life expectancy of the average British male is 89 not 81.
Secondly, that is life expectancy at birth; if you make it to 82 your life expectancy is about 89.
So to suggest that most people who die of COVID should be dead already is, as well as being absurd and callous, factually incorrect.
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Also, to say, "You have lived to be 80 or 90 so you should just die", as well as being extraordinarily unpleasant, is to dismiss (in the UK) 3.2 million people, who are over 80 (or 6000,000 who are over 90).
 
Phil H

Phil H

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Covid is a gift to corporates, scammers, banks, governments, and authoritarianism. Lord Falconer is alleged to have said (to lawyers) that "Covid is the gift that keeps on giving", and the PM said the success of Covid vaccine was due to capitalism and corporate greed; imho they were both telling the truth.

Mankind survived all manner of ills long before vaccines were invented and it will survive this one. Of course there have been casualties and there will be many more, but the burning question is how much more collateral damage are we prepared to accept before we say 'enough'?
 
lifes2short

lifes2short

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Phil H said:
Covid is a gift to corporates, scammers, banks, governments, and authoritarianism. Lord Falconer is alleged to have said (to lawyers) that "Covid is the gift that keeps on giving", and the PM said the success of Covid vaccine was due to capitalism and corporate greed; imho they were both telling the truth.

Mankind survived all manner of ills long before vaccines were invented and it will survive this one. Of course there have been casualties and there will be many more, but the burning question is how much more collateral damage are we prepared to accept before we say 'enough'?
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couldn't agree more
 
safrane

safrane

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Phil H said:
Covid is a gift to corporates, scammers, banks, governments, and authoritarianism. Lord Falconer is alleged to have said (to lawyers) that "Covid is the gift that keeps on giving", and the PM said the success of Covid vaccine was due to capitalism and corporate greed; imho they were both telling the truth.

Mankind survived all manner of ills long before vaccines were invented and it will survive this one. Of course there have been casualties and there will be many more, but the burning question is how much more collateral damage are we prepared to accept before we say 'enough'?
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You forgot to mention the loons, conspiratorial idiots, bigots, racists etc etc... I could go (rather like this thread).
 
MarkMas

MarkMas

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Phil H said:
Covid is a gift to corporates, scammers, banks, governments, and authoritarianism. Lord Falconer is alleged to have said (to lawyers) that "Covid is the gift that keeps on giving", and the PM said the success of Covid vaccine was due to capitalism and corporate greed; imho they were both telling the truth.
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I don't really understand the logic of what you are trying to say here. Yes Covid has been misused by scammers and profiteers, and yes some mad old coot foolishly admitted that changes to the law due to Covid has been good for lawyers. But it sounds as if you are saying, "There are bad and silly things associated with Covid, so, er, that proves that Covid isn't real or shouldn't be taken seriously."

Phil H said:
Mankind survived all manner of ills long before vaccines were invented and it will survive this one. Of course there have been casualties and there will be many more, but the burning question is how much more collateral damage are we prepared to accept before we say 'enough'?
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And this one is also confusing. Do you feel the same way about:
"Mankind survived smallpox and polio long before vaccines were invented and it will survive this one. Of course there have been casualties and there will be many more, but that's cool."

To be clear, I think it is possible to make a case that the collateral damage from anti-covid measures has been too high. But to try to make that case because there have been scammers and profiteers, or because millions used to die from smallpox, just seems really weird.
 
Phil H

Phil H

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MarkMas said:
But it sounds as if you are saying, "There are bad and silly things associated with Covid, so, er, that proves that Covid isn't real or shouldn't be taken seriously."
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Nope, I didn't say that.

MarkMas said:
"but that's cool."
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Nope, I didn't say that either.

MarkMas said:
But to try to make that case because there have been scammers and profiteers, or because millions used to die from smallpox, just seems really weird.
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Nor did I say that.

MarkMas said:
To be clear, I think it is possible to make a case that the collateral damage from anti-covid measures has been too high.
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By jove I think he's got it!
 
MarkMas

MarkMas

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Phil H said:
Nope, I didn't say that....
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So what did you say? I don't mean 'please repeat your post'. But what point were you trying to make? Or were you just telling us that scammers and authoritarians have taken advantage of Covid, and that mankind used not to have vaccines? I think we already knew that. I assumed you were somehow linking these thoughts to accepting casualties and not bothering to have vaccines, but apparently that's not what you meant.
 
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