FD sport springs, ride height and geo

mjheathcote

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I have a set of Formula Dynamics sports springs arriving in the next few days.
Has anyone any experience of fitting them and deciding on an appropriate ride height?
Being an early car mine is currently on stilts! Was thinking of lowering to GS height, which would be around a 1" drop (a 10mm drop if mine was a later 4200).
Also any experience to adjusting the geo to FD recommendations?
Thanks.
 

BennyD

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I take it they are stiffer than stock or you could get the same effect winding the collars down on the shocks. Also, be careful dropping too low, don't forget the GS had 19s and that last half inch could mean the difference in skimming the top of a speed bump or doing a NickP 'smack attack'.
 

mjheathcote

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9,046
They will be stiffer.
The difference between the 19" and 18" wheels is nothing (well actually 1mm on radius based on new tyres) because the larger 19" have a lower profile tyre.
Don't want to go too low, is GS height 'just right' for our roads?
 

BennyD

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They seem to cope! I always thought the GS filled the arches better because of the bigger wheels, apparently not. You live and learn!
 

Grinzzz

New Member
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No real problems changing springs on these, but I havent found a ride height I like yet. Had it corner weighted but it makes the car sit too low at the rear compared to the front. Visually it just looks odd to me.

One thing you might notice is with the FD springs is that non-sport will need to be reserved for smooth roads and the track; it's over sprung and under-damped which gives some interesting characteristics on bumpy B roads! Only time I turn off sport is on track or to avoid disturbing the neighbours.
 

Maser Sod

Member
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1,965
I have a set of Formula Dynamics sports springs arriving in the next few days.
Has anyone any experience of fitting them and deciding on an appropriate ride height?
Being an early car mine is currently on stilts! Was thinking of lowering to GS height, which would be around a 1" drop (a 10mm drop if mine was a later 4200).
Also any experience to adjusting the geo to FD recommendations?
Thanks.

I went 30mm lower than stock GranSport height. The springs were very rewarding on some roads, but a bit out of control on others - I found myself flicking the Sport button on and off at times to try to control the ride. It got a bit bouncy at times.
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
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9,046
No real problems changing springs on these, but I havent found a ride height I like yet. Had it corner weighted but it makes the car sit too low at the rear compared to the front. Visually it just looks odd to me.

One thing you might notice is with the FD springs is that non-sport will need to be reserved for smooth roads and the track; it's over sprung and under-damped which gives some interesting characteristics on bumpy B roads! Only time I turn off sport is on track or to avoid disturbing the neighbours.

So you happy with the change to FD springs?
Looking forward to a 'tighter' drive with less roll.
 

mjheathcote

Centenary Club
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9,046
I went 30mm lower than stock GranSport height. The springs were very rewarding on some roads, but a bit out of control on others - I found myself flicking the Sport button on and off at times to try to control the ride. It got a bit bouncy at times.

30mm drop than stock GS would be dropping mine 55mm, or over 2 inches!
Can't imagine going so low, I would be lifting up my bum on every dip on the road!
 

BennyD

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I'll be dropping mine 10mm max, if at all. I don't want any clearance issues as the exhausts, cats and main oil pipe don't react at all well to a car/Tarmac interface. Good luck!
 

Grinzzz

New Member
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925
I've not had a long term test on standards - the car came fitted with FD which was one of the reasons I chose it. The standard GSs I test drove didnt impress me as much they took much longer to take a "set" in corners (over damped). Personally I think FD have gone a bit too stiff, but thats more to do with my personal driving style than any right or wrong (and I'm talking a few lbs off rather than a lot).

If I ever change to another GS it'll be one of the first things I do with it.
 

Grinzzz

New Member
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925
I'll be dropping mine 10mm max
That sounds about right. I've tried a few heights now, and anything below that started to make the car too skittish on the FD springs. These arent aero critical cars! They do need some weight transfer to generate grip, especially in the rear, and hence some roll. If I was to try to improve further I think I'd look to a stiffer front ARB; I suspect that might stop the fronts getting overloaded with weight which appears to be generating the understeer. That or wider front tyres.
 

BennyD

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I don't need anything that makes it more skittish, the scuttle shake does that already! Does anyone know what the poundages for standard and FD springs are?
 

mjheathcote

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I don't think it's straight poundage, I would hope certainly with the FD springs they will be progressive wound.
I hope sticking to the 18" wheels will help with the ride, compared to GS/19" wheels with lower profile stiffer sidewalls.
 

BennyD

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I might just get a set of intermediates made to a stiffness somewhere between the GS and FDs. I'm in no rush as it handles as well as it needs to TBH.
 

Grinzzz

New Member
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Cant remember exact figures, but I think it was in the 350 rear, 500 front from what I recall. We checked them but I dont think we ever wrote the rates down duh. Never laid our hands on standard springs to test them.

Anyone got a set to test?
 

Grinzzz

New Member
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925
I might just get a set of intermediates made to a stiffness somewhere between the GS and FDs. I'm in no rush as it handles as well as it needs to TBH.
It'd be tempting to go higher rate than FD on the fronts and mid way on the rear and try it out. That might just hit a sweet spot.

Thing about suspension is one persons beautifully handling car is anothers understeering nightmare. It's all down to how you want to drive them. Personally I drive like miss daisy but like a car that turns in well, takes a set quickly and I can cope better with mild oversteer (ie doesnt snap) than understeer.
 

Emtee

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FWIW I found dropping the OEM springs on the collars was a noticeable improvement. IIRC the thread is 1.5mm and I dropped 12 turns I think, which seemed to equate to about 10mm on the body after the effect of damping. The limitations afterwards weren't suspension related; the remaining roll was largely down to the chassis twisting on the ARB.

If I was to do it again (which inevitably I probably will) I'd be dropping the standard springs and investing in the FD ARB's.
 

BennyD

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The main problem I can see with lowering it with the wider FD wheels is hitting the wheel arch with the tyres under hard acceleration (rear) and hard braking/turning (front). I'll see how I go as standard and may think about lowering over the winter.
 

Grinzzz

New Member
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925
The main problem I can see with lowering it with the wider FD wheels is hitting the wheel arch with the tyres under hard acceleration (rear) and hard braking/turning (front). I'll see how I go as standard and may think about lowering over the winter.
And thats one of the reasons to go stiffer sprung, the squat (under acceleration) and dive (braking) are reduced by the stiffer springs thus allowing you to go lower on the CofG. Reducing dive means theres less weight transfer onto the front tyres, thus reducing overload on the front. That means you have a wider window of grip opening up either later braking or trail braking (continuing braking into the turn). Might sound a bit "track focused" but also means you have a greater safety margin on the road too should the unexpected happen as it means you can brake harder and still steer.

The other reason for going stiffer is that standard is over damped, thus it takes longer for the car to settle down when cornering, this in turn means it's more difficult to get on the power earlier. It's not so much about the amount of roll, more about how long the car takes to "set" ie settle at a particular angle of roll. If it takes a long time (ie under sprung/over damped) you either have to wait longer before getting on the power or trust to luck (to an extent) that the body angle is the same each time you hit the power in a particular corner. Thats quite difficult to do so you end up missing apexes a lot more. You could get the same effect by softening the dampers too; try using non-sport mode on a track, depending on driving style you might find it faster!

The effect on body roll of stiffer springs is more of a side effect, in this case a welcome one. Some cars actually need body roll to put weight on the tyres to get them in the optimum window for grip, tends to happen on lightweight cars with wide tyres. 4200/GS is the opposite, especially at the front where the tyres are taking too much load. The prime way to reduce body roll is the ARB rather than springs. However I'd always get springs right first before starting to play with ARB; the effect of stiffer springs on dive gives much more useful benefits on the road than an ARB.

Quick question - does anyone make an adjustable ARB? I've looked but cant find one. Not keen on the FD kit, only the front needs tweaking for me, dont need both ends.
 
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