Handbrake Tip

[CatmanV2]

If I remember well, when you take you're foot off the brake pedal to pull away the brakes do not release for 1.4 seconds. That is the hill hold function. I never tested it with a stopwatch or tried to move my foot any quicker than that, but it is a little frustrating at times when trying to manoeuvre slowly.

Mine certainly doesn't do that!

But again, I do not have MSP. I think I *should* have hill hold, though, as I seem to have the very early TCU software

C

 

[CatmanV2]

Well we have both had the joys of taking 4200 arm rests apart and hiding a small blue parrot in our cars and we have both driven round Bruntingthorpe but I was slightly quicker than you were ! (I may have dreamed that part) so we seem to share a few car experiences at least

As for the hill hold function it could well be done with clutch slip as you suggest. I'm not sure how that bit works but it certainly acts as an automatic brake/hold function. I just had vision from the earlier post of someone thinking they could park in neutral and walk away and the car would automatically apply the brakes for them.

Definitely faster I really can't see the car applying the brakes for you, indeed why would it use the disc brakes. Sounds like a recipe for seized discs and pads.

C

 

[D Walker]

Tried this today on a very slight incline, turned off in 1st and hey presto, no roll back, applied handbrake on start up to reverse of said slope ( to test if it would hold) ahem - not likely sir!!

 

[spkennyuk]

Definitely faster I really can't see the car applying the brakes for you, indeed why would it use the disc brakes. Sounds like a recipe for seized discs and pads.

C

Thinking about it a bit more it probably is the disc brakes that are applied for the hill hold function. The Alfa 159 (manual) had it as well and as long as you put your foot on the brake pedal first while on a slope then it kept the disc brakes engaged for a second or so after taking your foot off the brakes. Brakes wouldnt bind as the function is on and off in under 2 seconds.

4200 system may be a combination of two methods suggested. Cluth slip if your in gear in traffic on a slope for example as in the nose of the car is pointing up hill in gear. If your pointing down hill then it will hold for a second or so on the disc brakes after you have taken your foot off the brake pedal or until you put your foot back on the loud pedal. I'm sure voicey or someone can confirm exactly how it works.

 

[Klive]

Mine certainly doesn't do that!

But again, I do not have MSP. I think I *should* have hill hold, though, as I seem to have the very early TCU software

C

Some of the software "upgrades" did lose the hill hold function and it was unable to put it back again. Perhaps this has happened to yours.

 

[CatmanV2]

I think I've got the very first software, but no apparent hill hold (tested today)

Is there some special way that it needs to be engaged?

C

 

[spkennyuk]

Procedure below Chris :-

Hill Holder Strategy
The Hill Holder system helps the driver
when starting-off on an uphill slope.
It intervenes only following a vehicle
stop when the brake pedal is released,
keeping the car stopped for a moment,
so as to allow the driver to move from
the brake to the accelerator pedal.
The system is capable of varying its
intervention time depending on the
road slope. This time ranges from a
minimum (0.06 seconds) on downhill
stretches and a maximum (1.2 seconds)
on uphill stretches, so that the driver
will not perceive the vehicle as
"braked" downhill.
The function that calculates the road
gradient is only active at speeds of over
8 km/h, therefore gradient changes at
lower speeds will not be detected.
Example: if you are driving uphill and
you make a reversing manoeuvre, the
system will not detect a gradient
change, and its maximum intervention
time will remain 1.2 seconds.

 

[CatmanV2]

So nothing do be done, other than stop on a hill

I don't have it

C

 

[spkennyuk]

So nothing do be done, other than stop on a hill

I don't have it

C

No just stop on a hill Mr C. I dont think the function Was there on the early models.

The gearbox software can be flashed up to the latest version. As i understand it but you cant revert back once you have upgraded.

 

[CatmanV2]

No just stop on a hill Mr C. I dont think the function Was there on the early models.

The gearbox software can be flashed up to the latest version. As i understand it but you cant revert back once you have upgraded.

I thought the hill hold was deleted on later versions. There's a matrix somewhere that shows it I think. Anyway, I don't want to upgrade. I like the kick in the pants when I'm cracking on

C

 

[Moz1000]

I think I've got the very first software, but no apparent hill hold (tested today)

Is there some special way that it needs to be engaged?

C

If I remember correctly, on the 4200, if you have the early TCU software, while in neutral and stationary, you pull the left hand paddle and hold it. There will be a beep to say the hold function has been activated.

I have driven the 4200 with the original TCU software and with the upgrade. Both have their pros and cons :- the original software gives a good kick at every gear change (especially with the foot to the floor), and supplies the blip on down-shifts. But pulling away from a standstill can be jerky. The upgrade irons out the jerkiness, but you lose the blip and the hill hold.

I don't think the hill hold worked particularly well - however, the left paddle lift is a good way of determining which version of software is loaded - early or upgrade.

I preferred the original software on my '52 4200 after having tried both versions.

Dave

 

[CatmanV2]

I thought the pull and hold activated the 'parking mode'

I shall go check in the manual, later

C

 

[Gooner]

Official guidance is always turn ignition off in 1st, so disc brakes are applied, assuming foot is on brake pedal. If you are in neutral when you switch off, you will notice an alarm sound. It will automatically apply disc brakes. When restarting, select neutral before turning ignition. No problem if you don't, it will do it automatically, again with an alarm sound.

Another vote for never using hand brake, having had the delaminating issue on day 10 of ownership sometime back.

Thanks, very helpful and now I do this I don't get the alarm every time I turn off. One thing I would add, if you have a Spyder, remember you need to activate the handbrake to close (or open) the roof. Otherwise you might fool yourself into thinking that the roof had stopped working, and have to use the manual process, which is a right pain, and then spend hours scouring the forums for convertible roof faults, before you remembered to try the handbrake again.

Doh!

 

[CatmanV2]

Thanks, very helpful and now I do this I don't get the alarm every time I turn off. One thing I would add, if you have a Spyder, remember you need to activate the handbrake to close (or open) the roof. Otherwise you might fool yourself into thinking that the roof had stopped working, and have to use the manual process, which is a right pain, and then spend hours scouring the forums for convertible roof faults, before you remembered to try the handbrake again.

Doh!

Clearly no one would actually do that, would they?

C

 

[Gooner]

If they did it would only be the once I can assure you of that.

 

[CatmanV2]

If they did it would only be the once I can assure you of that.

Well, naturally

C

 

[JonH]

You're absolutely right re disc brakes automatically coming on. What I kind of meant is you tend to have your foot in the brake when you turn ignition off, such that they remain engaged.
Sorry

The manual for the 4200 tells you to park it in gear. If you don't and you turn the ignition off with the car in neutral you will hear a sequence of beeps. it's 11 or 13 beeps in total. They are not very loud but you will hear them. The 4200 doesnt apply the brakes if you dont put the handbrake on. The brake will engage when you restart the car and select a gear or reverse as part of the hill hold function.

If you leave the handbrake off and leave the car in neutral with the ignition off the car will roll if on a slope. Likewise if you park up in gear on a slope with the handbrake off then take your foot off the footbrake it will roll forward a couple of inches and brake against the engine.

I will hold my hands up if i'm wrong but there is no evidence on my 4200 facelift 2007 model of an automatic brake system other than the hill hold system when your in gear with the ignition on. My drive is on a slope so I do let the car roll forwards without starting the car after washing it etc.

If you have left it parked in gear and you forget to put it in nuetral then yes it will select neutral for you. I think your foot has to be on the footbrake though hence the brakes are engaged.

 

[CatmanV2]

You're absolutely right re disc brakes automatically coming on. What I kind of meant is you tend to have your foot in the brake when you turn ignition off, such that they remain engaged.
Sorry

Why would they? Sorry, it needs energy to keep them *pressed* on. Taking your foot off when you get out releases the pressure from the system and the pads will return to their resting position (helped, I understand but the elasticity of the seals). Again, as far as I know there should be no difference doing this when stopped and turning the engine off, than when driving.

I may be confused

C