Yeah - apparently you have...Has anyone got any good news?
Its only money . It can all be fixed !
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Start up rattle on 4200 - With sound
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azapa
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it's the weekend in 3 days? No, but sounds very valve based (I know nothing about these engines). By the frequency and duration I'd guess the lifters are filling with oil.Has anyone got any good news?
Zep
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What does it sit at when the engine is warmed up and at idle? If it is around 1.2-1.5bar, then it probably isn’t the issue. But the best way to check it by fitting a gauge instead of using the dash indication.
In any event, you are going to need it looking at properly, as the internet is a bit hit and miss for diagnosis.
Andy4200
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Thanks everyone for your thoughts.
As you say, it's only money. Although having just spent nearly a grand replacing most of the a/c components, money is a little lacking at the moment.
It does sound a bit like tappets that have drained of oil, but normally you get one, possibly two. This sounds like the whole lot!
I will keep investigating and may end up taking the top end apart to investigate.
As you say, it's only money. Although having just spent nearly a grand replacing most of the a/c components, money is a little lacking at the moment.
It does sound a bit like tappets that have drained of oil, but normally you get one, possibly two. This sounds like the whole lot!
I will keep investigating and may end up taking the top end apart to investigate.
azapa
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if there is no valve to retain pressure, or the valve is dodgy: you'll get all sounding clickety clack, not just a few. In your case, it sounds like all.
doodlebug
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Mine sounds exactly the same on the occasional cold start-up, but only for a second or two. It had the non-return valve fitted a few years ago which did reduce the frequency of it happening. The strange thing is it often starts up without the rattle even if not driven for a couple of weeks but it can still occasionally make the noise when cold the next day after having driven it.
The car's done over 117k miles now and it's made the noise since I got it 100k miles ago, so I've just learned to ignore it. I'd definitely get yours checked because 9 seconds seems a little excessive.
The car's done over 117k miles now and it's made the noise since I got it 100k miles ago, so I've just learned to ignore it. I'd definitely get yours checked because 9 seconds seems a little excessive.
mjheathcote
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Fit some larinis and you won't be able to hear the the start up rattle for all the other noise.
Andy4200
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OK, here's today's next exciting video instalment. This is cold today to show how quickly the oil pressure comes up.
I've recently done an oil and filter change (10w40) and it runs just over 2 Bar when hot at idle, up around 5 Bar at speed. Noise was there before oil change as well.
The rattle didn't sound quite as bad today, still bad, just not as bad.
youtube.com
Interesting little gauge flick at 10 seconds. Something electrical kicking in I guess.
I've recently done an oil and filter change (10w40) and it runs just over 2 Bar when hot at idle, up around 5 Bar at speed. Noise was there before oil change as well.
The rattle didn't sound quite as bad today, still bad, just not as bad.
8 September 2021
youtube.com
Interesting little gauge flick at 10 seconds. Something electrical kicking in I guess.
Zep
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From in the car it sounds ok after the clackety clack. The little flick on the gauge could be a) the wiper inside the sender sticking or b) very occasionally a problem with the oil pump drive or if it coincides with the fans starting you need to look at your earth strap as it might be lose or not making good contact. 2 bar hot is quite but you might mean after it’s showing normal operating temp rather than after a drive, so about right.
Devonboy
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You have pressure but don’t have circulation….initially for 10 secs - get it to a pro and get a diagnosis!OK, here's today's next exciting video instalment. This is cold today to show how quickly the oil pressure comes up.
I've recently done an oil and filter change (10w40) and it runs just over 2 Bar when hot at idle, up around 5 Bar at speed. Noise was there before oil change as well.
The rattle didn't sound quite as bad today, still bad, just not as bad.
8 September 2021
Interesting little gauge flick at 10 seconds. Something electrical kicking in I guess.
boomerang
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Probably just the accumulator lost its nitrogen filling.
Then, when you start the engine, the oil pump first has to fill this accumulator, before oil pressure is built into the variators.
First thing I exchanged was the non return valve in the left cilinderhead indeed.
Did not change a thing.
Made a pre lube system years ago, to obtain oil pressure in the variator circuit, before starting the engine. No more ratlle / ticking/ noise whatsoever. Great solution, especially when first started after the winterstop.
But in fact, the accumulator is the real problem.
Still have to exchange the thing.
Then, when you start the engine, the oil pump first has to fill this accumulator, before oil pressure is built into the variators.
First thing I exchanged was the non return valve in the left cilinderhead indeed.
Did not change a thing.
Made a pre lube system years ago, to obtain oil pressure in the variator circuit, before starting the engine. No more ratlle / ticking/ noise whatsoever. Great solution, especially when first started after the winterstop.
But in fact, the accumulator is the real problem.
Still have to exchange the thing.
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boomerang
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My 2002 MB 500SL has a lot of accumulators all over the car.
They all where gone, I had to exchange them all.
Since they are used in the electronic braking system and the active body control hydraulic suspension, this has become a very well known issue.
The nitrogen filling will be gone after 10-15 years, regardless in what system an accumulator is being used.
Same problem can be found in the Maserati Cambio Corsa gearbox hydraulic system. A lot of cars are running with a bad accumulator, causing the pressure pump having to work harder and stressing the hydraulic system with high pressure peaks.
So because of these experiences, my bet; Accumulator.
They all where gone, I had to exchange them all.
Since they are used in the electronic braking system and the active body control hydraulic suspension, this has become a very well known issue.
The nitrogen filling will be gone after 10-15 years, regardless in what system an accumulator is being used.
Same problem can be found in the Maserati Cambio Corsa gearbox hydraulic system. A lot of cars are running with a bad accumulator, causing the pressure pump having to work harder and stressing the hydraulic system with high pressure peaks.
So because of these experiences, my bet; Accumulator.
boomerang
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My worries about ordering a new one; how new are the really!
A unit that was in stock for several years, is not new anymore.
Nitrogen filling pressure could already have gone down.
This is why Mercedes accumulators best can be bought at a remanufacture firm.
They refill the accumulator and test its behavior on a test bench before delivery.
If we knew what the original pressure in our accumulator was, this could also be a good solution for our “variator accumulator”.
A unit that was in stock for several years, is not new anymore.
Nitrogen filling pressure could already have gone down.
This is why Mercedes accumulators best can be bought at a remanufacture firm.
They refill the accumulator and test its behavior on a test bench before delivery.
If we knew what the original pressure in our accumulator was, this could also be a good solution for our “variator accumulator”.
The hydraulic gearbox set up on CC boxes requires an infinitely more crucial parameter however...Very small losses , a much more sensitive system....and it all goes bad.
I’m pretty sure the accumulator needs nothing like the same consistency to work..
Nitrogen isn’t affected by heat. Why Nissan put it in the tyres of the GTRs....
Of course, that says nothing of the seals used. It’s an inhospital environment it’s located in certainly.....
I’m pretty sure the accumulator needs nothing like the same consistency to work..
Nitrogen isn’t affected by heat. Why Nissan put it in the tyres of the GTRs....
Of course, that says nothing of the seals used. It’s an inhospital environment it’s located in certainly.....
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By the time the variator damages itself, as it surely must, you are left working out which to change first. If the solenoid seals are blown, and bleeding oil loss, you simply have to bite the bullet and do the lot....?
People have reported results from changing solenoids alone. Others did variants fir it to return in short order...
Head scratching...
People have reported results from changing solenoids alone. Others did variants fir it to return in short order...
Head scratching...
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Zep
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We know how it works, we don’t know why it isn’t in your case though!
The list of things that could be wrong is quite long. Blocked oil passage, chain guides, solenoids, variators themselves. Everyone here is going to say it’s the thing that happened to them or they have heard about. Your going to have to work through the list.
The list of things that could be wrong is quite long. Blocked oil passage, chain guides, solenoids, variators themselves. Everyone here is going to say it’s the thing that happened to them or they have heard about. Your going to have to work through the list.
Here another vague comment.
Mine had a kink in the oil hose from the tank when I bought it. I am almost convinced that the oil pressure readings got better after I straightened out the mesh around the hose, but I could just be imagining it. Car was new to me and it was one of the hottest summers a few years ago. At least it is easy to check and free, but you do get the fun of removing what previous owners thought was an appropriate way to fix the undertray.
Mine had a kink in the oil hose from the tank when I bought it. I am almost convinced that the oil pressure readings got better after I straightened out the mesh around the hose, but I could just be imagining it. Car was new to me and it was one of the hottest summers a few years ago. At least it is easy to check and free, but you do get the fun of removing what previous owners thought was an appropriate way to fix the undertray.