Sub post masters saga

[lozcb]

Found myself listening these last dew months to the transcripts of the Post Office Enquiry , interesting listening , and in some instances down right shocking at which some complacency was carried out resulting in such devastation for others ...........views on whether some corporate heads should not only roll but end up doing some porridge

 

[CatmanV2]

Completely. Wild incompetence at the highest levels. Failure of due diligence all over. Perjury and perverting the course of justice as well as lying to Commons Select Comittee.

Some of the people were nowhere near competent to hold exec level roles in an organisation like that.

Been watching it when I can. Actually Leighton, yesterday, was one of the only POL staff that came off reasonably

C

 

[safrane]

I doubt any one in real authority will face any consequences for the saga.

They will use Post Office money to pay millions to legal teams to avoid any punishment, be it custodial or financial.

Politicians will also push it into the long grass as so many parties were in charge during the saga... and they don't want any mud on thier shoes and there are too few votes to be won.

 

[Phil H]

Over the years it's been reported that a number of Postmasters/Postmistresses suffered ill health and death due to the stress imposed by prosecutions, and it is alleged that there was at least one suicide; imho charges of corporate manslaughter would not be remiss. The problem, though, is that the establishment always protects its own, and mealy mouthed words from Westminster don't count for much.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Personally I feel it's about time that some former CEO heads should roll (custodial sentencing) including confiscation of Pensions for such imcompetence, that has destroyed lives, caused suicide and is still impacting people despite exoneration.

You are a CEO of a firm and should know EVERY nuance of the company you are managing. I

 

[CatmanV2]

I doubt any one in real authority will face any consequences for the saga.

Sadly you may be right, but I can live in hope

You are a CEO of a firm and should know EVERY nuance of the company you are managing. I

And / or accept the responsibility of what goes on on your watch. I *suspect* Vennells will be the scapegoat in question. However having watched some of the other evidence it should not be limited to her.

The astounding thing is that POL seem to be still utterly tone deaf. They make no comment other than 'We're assisting the enquiry' and are *still* prosecuting sub post officer masters (although to be fair, their probably are some that are on the fiddle, but you *probably* don't call the help desk *120 times* to report shortages if you have your hand in the till) They are *still* failing to disclose before the last possible instant. Effectively (In my view) they are still deliberately trying to pervert the course of justice)


C

 

[P5Nij]

The sheer arrogance and indifference on display from the PO management is beyond shocking, it's utterly disgusting. The shifty body language and ''nothing to do with me guv'' answers speak volumes. From Vennells on downwards numerous people should be doing stir for a very long time. Once again we see a large organisation which thinks 'losing corporate face' overrides truth and honesty.

 

[CatmanV2]

Currently watching Rodric Williams turning on a spit...

It's deeply embarassing.

C

 

[allandwf]

as well as lying to Commons Select Comittee

Shown by example to be be acceptable unfortunately.

 

[jemgee]

I have waited for someone to ask the questions
1) Before Horizon what system was used to record sub post offices sales and pension payments etc, pen and ink?
2) What was the frequency and value of errors and frauds resulting in prosecutions etc before Horizon?
3) When Horizon was trialled/rolled out etc was any comparison/evaluation made between 1 and 2.

It seems to me that significant increases between 1, 2 and 3 should have resulted in the inevitable question of all computer programmes - garbage in = garbage out

 

[lozcb]

Currently watching Rodric Williams turning on a spit...

It's deeply embarassing.

C

An astute but bumbling idiot team player, one of the best so far testimonies that emphasised the culture within, the guy needs to be struck off at the very minimum

 

[Zep]

From what I have read, the answers are:

1) Yes
2) Very low
3) It appears not - which is why it all happened.

Group Think is a known phenomenon in board rooms and management teams and life in general. Assertions not challenged. Simple explanations accepted. Charts manipulated. Usually it results in poor results, not the needless ruining of hundreds of lives.

 

[jemgee]

Currently watching Rodric Williams turning on a spit...

It's deeply embarassing.

C

All qualified legals and solicitors can expect a ton of bricks from their professional bodies who are poised to enter the fray when the inquiry is finished

Law Society Gazette - Post Office scandal: echoes of Watergate? | Legal Risk LLP Solicitors

legalrisk.co.uk

Statement: Update on the Solicitors Regulation Authority investigation on the Post Office Horizon IT scandal

In light of the recent significant interest in the Post Office Horizon Scandal and the resumption of hearings at the ongoing statutory public inquiry, we are providing an update on our investigation, building on our October 2022 statement.

www.sra.org.uk

 

[lozcb]

Personally i think a whole load of other data needs to be collated and reasoned after this , Like pre/post Horizon what were the annual legal costs both in house and external usage, I have a sneaky feeling that what was going on may well have lined the pockets seriously of a few legal teams, obviously they saw it as a gravy train to be ridden for as long as possible.
Its not rocket science to ask for a pre horizon total of the number of post submasters prosecuted say from 1990 to 2000 and then have the yearly totals transposed onto a graph ........i think that would have revealed some shocking truths and prompted those in charge to have investigated further as to why there was there such a dramatic rise, if indeed that is the case ... I 'll eat my hat and everyone elses on this forum if im proved wrong

 

[CatmanV2]

Its not rocket science to ask for a pre horizon total of the number of post submasters prosecuted say from 1990 to 2000 and then have the yearly totals transposed onto a graph ........i think that would have revealed some shocking truths and prompted those in charge to have investigated further as to why there was there such a dramatic rise, if indeed that is the case ... I 'll eat my hat and everyone elses on this forum if im proved wrong

Yes. I expect such data would reveal a dramatic rise. However, the expectation was there *would* be a dramatic rise because HO believed the sub post masters were on the take.

Have we talked about confirmation bias on this forum before?...

C

 

[Swedish Paul]

Yes. I expect such data wold reveal a dramatic rise. However, the expectation was there *would* be a dramatic rise because HO believed the sub post masters were on the take.

Have we talked about confirmation bias on this forum before?...

C

Confirmed.

 

[lozcb]

Nice to see Roderick Williams back in the squirming chair again this morning , already calls for him to be sacked from his post , the guy needs to be disbarred for life and more

 

[lozcb]

After watching his testimony cant say I have ever wanted to see someone commiserating in lonely isolated cell than this guy .........very clinically distasteful

 

[Felonious Crud]

Interesting topic... but let's keep it sensible and informed, please. No issue to kill it if it starts to get silly and shouty.

 

[lozcb]

Interesting topic... but let's keep it sensible and informed, please. No issue to kill it if it starts to get silly and shouty.

Have i missed something , whose got out of alignment