To Buy or Not To Buy? That is the question?

adrianr

New Member
Messages
58
I would be really interested to hear everybody's thoughts on this one. So I've been looking for a low mileage circa £20k QP for a few weeks now. Seen a couple and I am liking the ZF auto above the DS. That's driving the price up though, but that's OK.
So today I went to see a 2008 QP GT S with ZF gearbox and 44k miles on the clock and advertised at £23.5k. It looks lovely and seemed to drive without any problems (although I'm no mechanic). Probably the straightest car I've seen so far in all honesty, but not seen many. Engine bay all clean and sound – but then I discover it has red cam covers and ask about this. It has the 4.7 engine fitted.
Story seems to be that the car required a replacement engine due to water ingress screwing the hydraulics? The owner was paid out via insurance, but then wanted the extra horsepower so fitted the 4.7 lump (second hand QP engine acquired with 22k on the clock). So the engine only has 34k now which is better than I thought, but no longer standard and matching numbers etc….
Some other inconsistencies found with the service history, and slightly sketchy, but I am convinced that this is just genuine errors and omissions and everything is capable of researching and legitimising with copy records. I have full access to the independent specialist who carried out all of the work and don't doubt that enough evidence can be found to support the story.
By the way they also fitted the gearbox from the new engine – and had Maserati change all their records so the car now recorded as 4.7 engine etc….
So a great looking car; I believe a genuine story – but not straightforward; even lower mileage than expected; and better engine!
Should I buy it? What should I be concerned to validate? What should I pay for it?
Before you answer the last question I have bid £20k!!.
 
Messages
6,001
Hmm a conundrum
You say 2008 and 34000 miles
Variators seem to need replacing around 45000 miles, these are expensive
Plenty to think about with the other stuff though too
Why was the engine replaced water in the hydraulics? has there been an accident too?
It seems like a bargain but I am wary
 

safrane

Member
Messages
16,869
I think he means the engine was Hydro locked - that is water was ingresses into the cylinders which will not compress and therefore scrap the motor. This is a common problem for all cars where the air intake system is very low and the car is driven into a deep puddle.
 

Luna 06

Junior Member
Messages
74
I think you have to think of resale further down the line.
If it's got you thinking, it will others.
 

Gp79

Member
Messages
1,398
Sounds like trouble to me.

it's a buyers market so I would hold out and find a low owner / mile one with decent history, not been messed with.
 

Wack61

Member
Messages
8,794
The brakes are much bigger on the 4.7 so I assume this has 4.2 brakes

I think it's an insurance nightmare , once you start telling them it's modified your choice of insurers will drop pushing the premium up
 

Andyk

Member
Messages
61,157
This is an interesting one a non facelift car with 4.7 .... I would dismiss but the price has to be good and find out as much as you can..who did the work, etc.
 

adrianr

New Member
Messages
58
Hi Andy, Yes it is an interesting one. A non facelift car with 4.7 engine .... The price was advertised at £23.5k. I offered £20k - but haven't heard yet. This seems like a good price to me - properly discounted for the problematic history. If you forget the re-sale issue - then what's the problem with the car?

The work was done by a Ferrari/Maserati independent in Midlands - now trading under a different name. I have met and spoken to mechanic who performed all the work - now working back at a respected Ferrari main dealer! He seemed like a totally genuine chap!

Would you still dismiss it?
 

Wack61

Member
Messages
8,794
I think you need to find out if the brakes are standard 4.7 brakes or something else, the problem tha usually arises with modified cars is not knowing what parts were used so when something breaks the problems start.

Did the ECU have to be modified to get it to run , are the injectors different or is the 4.7 just a bigger version of the 4.2 which went straight in plug and play

How long has it been running with the 4.7 engine in it

First of all get an insurance quote with the mods declared and compare it to a standard car

Oh and the 4.7 brakes cost almost 10x the cost of the 4.2 so that was an expensive modification so it'll be expensive when they need replacing
 

Gp79

Member
Messages
1,398
Hi Andy, Yes it is an interesting one. A non facelift car with 4.7 engine .... The price was advertised at £23.5k. I offered £20k - but haven't heard yet. This seems like a good price to me - properly discounted for the problematic history. If you forget the re-sale issue - then what's the problem with the car?

The work was done by a Ferrari/Maserati independent in Midlands - now trading under a different name. I have met and spoken to mechanic who performed all the work - now working back at a respected Ferrari main dealer! He seemed like a totally genuine chap!

Would you still dismiss it?

My car was serviced by the same mechanic for 4 years before I bought it, so know they are reputable.

If you're not worried about resale and you know EXACTLY what was done, full report, invoices etc it could be ok.

But for me the risks out weigh any gains.
 

drewf

Member
Messages
7,159
Interesting. If it was my car, with a blown 4.2 and a decent 4.7 to go in, then I'd no doubt be very happy with the outcome and I'd do it. BUT, that would only be on the basis of it being a keeper, since I'd know it would be a pig to sell. Would I buy a conversion done by someone else with a few missing parts to the story? No.
 

Jkulin

Junior Member
Messages
983
Hi Adrian,

I looked at this very car the weekend before, it was truly quite lovely mechanically, but I dismissed it as I couldn't live with the interior.

I have absolutely no doubt that the seller/mechanic is good at what he does, apparently he is selling it on behalf of a client who is reducing down his Maserati fleet.

In fact I plan to use the mechanic for my 2010 QP as he is only about 12 miles from me and I felt comfortable with him.

After seeing this I decided to up my budget and get a later model with a nicer interior (Personal taste)
 

Ewan

Member
Messages
6,812
Run away fast. There are lovely and original QP's to be had for around the £20k mark, so why buy a lash up? If the work had been completed by an official Masrati dealer and was warrantied with all the correct paperwork, then maybe go with a low bid. But with the level of work currently unknown, by a garage which has since changed name, why would you?
 

beau

Member
Messages
1,391
it really is down to you, nearly everyone on here wants originality, iv been looking at quattroporte's as i fancy one, and this sounds like exactly the sort of thing i would be after, bigger and lower mileage engine is only a bonus in my opinion.
 

CatmanV2

Member
Messages
48,793
it really is down to you, nearly everyone on here wants originality, iv been looking at quattroporte's as i fancy one, and this sounds like exactly the sort of thing i would be after, bigger and lower mileage engine is only a bonus in my opinion.

I confess, I'd be interested at the correct price. There's always a buyer if you want to move it on

C