Care homes and care workers

[keith]

Forgive this completely off topic point. I was watching a story on Channel 4 news re the pay of care workers. Whilst the free market economists among us, and I am not a million miles removed from them I have to admit, would say if you don't like the job and pay do something else. However for a lot of people in the industry who perhaps are unable to get work elsewhere perhaps due to issues surrounding qualifications and skills, this is the only job available. But to pay them as little as £8.00 an hour approximately, does to me seem to be an abuse of position, and perhaps a little bit of greed on the part of the care home owners. Surely there must be enough profit in that business to pay something even approaching a respectable wage, or is it the case that because they have never had to why should that start now. A care worker being interviewed lives with her son in one room of a house, sharing washing facilities with ten others! She is doing what to me would seem like a tough committed job, surely there's money in the industry to pay these people more?
Just to conclude I am certainly no 'left wing socialist Jeremy Corbyn supporter' who is always desperate to high light the disparity that exists between the rich and poor in society, and this is the first time I have ever put a point like this in writing, but it just touched a nerve with me. Also I don't mean to use the old adage 'screw the rich' etc etc, but to repeat myself surely there must be something that can be done to help such people. Clapping is fine, but I think a bit more money would help a lot more.
By the way I don't mean to cause offence to anyone with this point, so apologies in advance!

 

[Wack61]

Many care workers have families so to make ends meet it's 8 hours looking after kids 8 hours sleep , 8 hours on the night shift at a care home.

Years ago I dated a girl for a few months, she worked in a care home, they're all nice little old ladies on the TV but real life there are lots of cantankerous old people who are rude and violent , she'd been bitten a few times

£800-1200 a week per guest , yes you'd think they could pay more than minimum wage.

 

[midlifecrisis]

I'm sure the care industry is regulated and Care assistants must have certain qualifications to achieve in order to work, but so I'd agree they should get a decent wage to reflect that.
I think there's more too it than the journalists report. A lot are private and probably failed to anticipate the pandemic and are now pleading innocence in getting the proper equipment.
Expect a few to go to the wall as their market has sadly dramatically diminished recently.
Minimum wage should be for those who are unqualified to carry out the job or there's no skills required. Certainly not Care workers.

 

[allandwf]

Yes they need qualifications, and more if you want to look after kids with special needs. My nephew is getting his qualifications now. I couldn't do their job, but people who care for others do seem to get a rough deal all round.

 

[RoaryRati]

Not only do they get low pay - and are considered low skilled, but everyone ignores their untrainable talented - they are also low regarded. A reasonably well paid neighbor, who works in insurance, says how 'stressful' it is to go into a property with all these expensive items. I did not pass comment that I look after priceless objects (their children) on minimum wage............

 

[dunnah01]

Just read this post again in 12 months time to see if anything has realy changed - I hope so but have my doubts

 

[philw696]

Wow what a good thread.
For many years my twin brother had been working overseas in KL Malaysia doing International removals and storage around the World.
Towards the end of last year he realised things were changing and decided to come back to the UK.
He had a job organised in his field and was due to start beginning of March all good and a nice package as you would expect with his international experience.
Sunday afternoon before the start of the job a phonecall saying no more job then CV19 and major rethink.
He is now a Carer in a Adult Care Home for 4 adults with severe mental health issues on minimum wage but this care costs the Country £2,000 to £2,500 a week.
He has had to be Police checked and do numerous NVQs to do the job.
At the moment he is being shadowed whilst learning the ropes.
I know I couldn't do it and take my hat off to him.
He tells me it's the only work there's plenty of at this moment in time.
I really hope the Government look into all this and for all key workers and address the pay situation.
He did say after years of having to achieve targets it was a nice relief to just go in to work and go home at the end of a shift.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Woke up early, so here's some brief but factual research.
Looking on the Which website, typical costs are around £60k a year for a residential care home (based on the average amount self-funders pay for a residential care home in the area of Surrey County Council) £35k for Salford. It's not cheap.
Obviously a home has to be built in a certain way, capital costs for specialist equipment etc. And the Care Quality Commission do inspect.
Looking at the Indeed website I could see care assistant jobs ranging from £8.80 to £22 an hour but typically around £10.

Make of that what you will. Is the industry fragmented, meaning high costs and low profit margins for owners, or are fatcats at play?

 

[Phil H]

Charges increase substantially if the client needs any level of nursing care and the staff qualifications are higher for that, rather than for basic residential care. It is physically hard work and mentally demanding, and I have witnessed residents attacking staff so it's not without risk.

For far too long governments have promised to address funding issues but have singularly failed to do so; I'd like to think the Covid pandemic will change their minds but I doubt it as it mainly affects 'old folk' so they simply don't care (if they did they would have acted long ago), and it is all about money. We know from experience that a clinical diagnosis requiring state funded care can miraculously change to a lower level at the point of admission, so the patient pays!

I've seen care homes that I wouldn't dream of using and there are some very good ones out there, but none are cheap and the owners I've come across do seem rather affluent unlike the staff they employ so read into that what you will.

Social Care should figure just as highly on government agendas as any other aspect of healthcare, but I doubt it ever will. The CQC is concerned with standards not funding, so I think it unlikely that they will ever influence funding issues; that requires government conscience which is sadly lacking.

PH

 

[midlifecrisis]

If the CQC has bite like the CAA they can withdraw licenses if standards are particularly poor or serious neglect is detected. Of course a single audit would not find that.

 

[safrane]

Not only do they get low pay - and are considered low skilled, but everyone ignores their untrainable talented - they are also low regarded. A reasonably well paid neighbor, who works in insurance, says how 'stressful' it is to go into a property with all these expensive items. I did not pass comment that I look after priceless objects (their children) on minimum wage............

Indeed, the fact that we all grow old and will need some form of social care escapes most.

I am frequently riled by comments that child care is so expensive, as to is care home provision... it ruddy should be. As you state they are looking after your most treasued items, surely it should be expensive!
Staff should have a GOOD living wage and no one working in the UK should find themselves living in one room.

 

[TimR]

Staff should have a GOOD living wage and no one working in the UK should find themselves living in one room.
[/QUOTE]

Im afraid there isnt much new here...
People who are so called 'employed' , and not just those on 'zero hour' contractual arrangements but in some cases, "key workers' have been reported living out of tents and the like....
A govt that doesnt care* for people is a govt that doesnt understand how to cultivate a functioning economy...
(*doesnt care here means undervalues/misunderstands the importance of the contribution)
Austerity hasnt done anything to reduce the deficit- indeed; we see a welfare system that is unable to cope thanks largely to under investment. When you need it, its not there.
Already the Tories are saying they want to freeze public sector pay to cover the costs of CV19.
Dont fall for it.
They have agreed to pay the oil companies £750M in a bonds scheme (so they can pay their bonuses....?)
Care homes still wait for £600m from a needed £3billion shortfall...
Too little, too late...
Bl00dy charlatans...

 

[lozcb]

Look around guys, tell me how many governments are there in the world that truly care about its citizens , here we are moaning about our countries so called shortfalls , if it really meant that much to you , then 30 years ago you would have gone into politics to create change , but no you chose to go into a field for self enrichment , in other words you were happy to farm or contract out you ideals to someone else , as many families do nowdays with there parents , basically your putting that responsibility onto the shoulders of others less caring . Now you want to blame and ridicule them ,I suggest a lot of you take a hard long look in the mirror and list the reasons you couldn't or wouldn't take the responsibility of looking after your own parents ...... I would hazard a guess it's because it would have affected your own self enrichment , so how caring are we ......just saying like

 

[Ianed0]

My missus has been in nursing and care work all her life up until when she retired a couple of years ago, a lot of this has been in residential homes. The pay has always been **** for what they do compared to other industries, typically £8-£10 an hour, the biggest problem is a lot of these homes are privately owned, the last one she worked in was and although they charge a minimum of £500-£600 a week they still struggle to make it pay, I certainly wouldn't want to wipe peoples arses for that but as they use to say nursing is a vocation. Up until all this it certainly lacked the respect it use to have. I remember when my wife worked as an SRN in the NHS years back when nursing was considered a very respected career, lets hope when we come out of all this ALL areas of care will gain the respect they rightly deserve and recognised in there pay structure.

 

[safrane]

A very valid point Loz.

I know of cases where family have refused to take Gran out of a hospital bed when they are fit enough to leave but need care at home... the reason given in this case was they were going to Florida for a three week holiday... so Gran goes into a home or stays in BRI.

My own adopted mother nused both her parents at their home before they died; she was a maricurie nurse after retirement from the NHS. No idea how she copes emotionally with that... she did the same for her brother in law last year... and she is in her 70s!!!

 

[Wack61]

Im afraid there isnt much new here...
People who are so called 'employed' , and not just those on 'zero hour' contractual arrangements but in some cases,

Zero hour contracts should've been outlawed before they came off the printer

My only experience was when my son was 16 , he got a part time job at McDonalds sat sun but they really took the **** , they'd give him a shift starting at noon which was a £5 return bus ride away , he'd be flat out for 2 hours then once the rush was over they'd send him home , after bus fare he cleared £7

He did that 3 weekends on the trot before I found out IKEA were hiring , more money, a 10 minute walk and they gave him a guaranteed 16 hour week so when the manager rang he got told where to shove it.

 

[philw696]

Interesting what you find on a Google search.

https://www.carehome.co.uk/news/article.cfm/id/1625875/Coronavirus-testing-denied-to-people-with-learning-disabilities-despite-huge-rise-in-their-deaths

 

[Swedish Paul]

When I was 16, my gran had a stroke. My auntie suggested a home and I went absolutely apeshit. My gran moved in with us and as a family we looked after her for several years. Many sacrifices, my brother and i slept in a 3mx2m bedroom in bunk beds. One person at home nearly full time. But you know what. It’s family. It used to mean something.

I understand that some old folks need more care than can be got at home, but as a society we have two have a new car every couple of years, holiday abroad and watch tv on an 80 inch monster. No wonder society has gone to the wall.

 

[philw696]

No Zero Hour contracts here in France.

 

[lozcb]

No Zero Hour contracts here in France.

Your only looking at the surface detail Phil , the problem is with us , yes us ,it's a horrible thought ,but we as families are shirking our responsibilities to our elders , we have the opportunity to vote with our feet and not fill these nursing homes with our kin folk