THE FUTURE vs THE PAST!!

philw696

Member
Messages
25,442
Nippy, yes. But still slow.
Whereas the Alpine can crack a sub 4 second 0-60.

Overall, the Alpine is cheaper than its equivalent Porsche, as well as being lighter, faster, and more fun. But still the masses buy Caymans instead. It baffles me.

The Alpine is still heavier and slower than my Westfield though. A car that makes the Fulvia sound 150kg overweight and 150bhp underpowered!
Ewan out of interest have you ever driven a Fulvia ?
They really are a Special little Car that was a WRC Winner that cost more than a Jaguar Etype new.
I have a lot of love for them as my father was involved with the Jolly Club in the 60's and 70's.
Either way you've convinced me and I'm having a poverty spec Alpine.
 

Guy

Member
Messages
2,133
1100kg a bit lardy then ;)

A standard Fulvia S2 is about 950kg, mine has a few weight saving mods, ally openings, magnesium wheels, light weight seats etc so probably 900kg or thereabouts you certainly notice the lack of weight in the way it handles and changes direction and is surprisingly nippy powered by its 93 bhp 1.3 V4
The fulvia is about the same weight as the 205GTis I used to own in the 80s. They were more powerful and torquey but wouldn't want to have an accident in thrm (or the Fulvia or most things short of a Merc or Saab from that era!) but that is part of the modern weight problem!
 

Guy

Member
Messages
2,133
In my opinion they look great. It’s a flat 4 but now a 230bhp 2.4 instead of the 2.0 of the GT86. Much better torque too. It’s a great car, feels (and is) much lighter than most modern cars, handles very well, really fun to drive. Plenty quick enough for uk roads, not as fast as an alpine/cayman of course but you can use more of it. Not as refined in an NVH way as most modern cars, but I like that more raw feel. You have to be quite precise with throttle/clutch in low gears or you can be a tad learner-ish. I think it’s just throttle mapping being quite aggressive for the responsive feel. You soon get used to it though.
No nanny state stuff to turn off like lane assist, speed bongs, cameras looking ant your eyes etc. All it has is blind spot lights in mirrors. That’s it. Great.

They stopped making them for europe because of the new ISA/GSR2 rules for all the ‘safety’ cr@p that is mandatory for all new cars sold from July 24 (that no-one actually wants)
sounds fantastic! except the ISA/GSR2 part. Who made that nannying bit of legislation up?
 

Ewan

Member
Messages
6,812
Ewan out of interest have you ever driven a Fulvia ?
They really are a Special little Car that was a WRC Winner that cost more than a Jaguar Etype new.
I have a lot of love for them as my father was involved with the Jolly Club in the 60's and 70's.
Either way you've convinced me and I'm having a poverty spec Alpine.
Only driven one once, and that was maybe 30 years ago. Can’t recall much about it now though. Obviously a fun car, and handsome.
 

TimR

Member
Messages
2,731
I don’t agree with all his assumptions. Clearly out of his lane in a couple areas but no one has mentioned ‘modeling’ in this thread. I happened to google CAD in car design recently. First appeared in production automotive design circa 1950’s if memory serves.
Modern isnt just EV. Modern engineering is capable of many incredible things. You have to pay for the good stuff. Careful what you buy…..

 

Felonious Crud

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
21,180
Nippy, yes. But still slow.
Whereas the Alpine can crack a sub 4 second 0-60.

Overall, the Alpine is cheaper than its equivalent Porsche, as well as being lighter, faster, and more fun. But still the masses buy Caymans instead. It baffles me.

The Alpine is still heavier and slower than my Westfield though. A car that makes the Fulvia sound 150kg overweight and 150bhp underpowered!
The Alpine sounds good. too. At least, the one that came rattling past a taxi I was in a while back sounded pretty fruity.
 
Messages
310
This may not be my most eloquent reply but have have only had 1 beer here in Phuket so here goes….

I plan never to own or drive and EV unless mandated by law.

Their TCO on the environment including manufacturing is in my humble, terrible.

They are a climate green-washing slight of hand.

The ICE today if you buy new is crazily efficient and emissions are very very low (good use of regulation).

The problem is not the ICE but the fossil fuel you put in it. Solution……

Also did you know that 83% of an ICE car can be recycled, that is amazing.

Ban fossil fuels over 10 years (can’t do quicker) and mandate petroleum producers to produce carbon/capture e-fuels as a replacement. Means that everyone who does not own an electric car or cannot afford one does not have to change their car. It’s a win win for everyone. We also stop mining half of Chile to death for the lithium that’s almost like the 17th century sweet tooth that caused many atrocities….

If that does not work, ban all diesel/fuel munching ships and planes that bring us our goodies from all over the world when we demand them. Have you ever seen the Evergiven up close at Felixstowe. Truly jaw dropping in size. Yes, the end of just in time globalisation but is that such a bad thing?

Now off to my 2nd beer…. I’ll keep the phone off!

Stu
 

Scaf

Member
Messages
6,579
Thats the same exact dilemma im in now Phil , looking for that final fling as to reignite my fire , Masser will get the attention its become accustom to and after 20 years its embedded in my DNA , but I need a renewed passion ........Bentley is a wonderful waft but too over engineered to give worry free ownership , My head says put two fingers up to the tax man and look for something concours pre 1984 to beat the Road tax Mot and Ulez ( not that Ulez affects me that often .........but thats where Im at and still undecided where to go ..........Mk2 Jag ............Jensen interceptor , im not in the price bracket for 3500gt My original thoughts were Audi R8 or a GTR as a dalliance , but then i would be in the same position im in now
A final fling to light my fire, is likely to be a leggy blonde half my age and cost more than the
Alpine ;)
 

Felonious Crud

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
21,180
If that does not work, ban all diesel/fuel munching ships and planes that bring us our goodies from all over the world when we demand them. Have you ever seen the Evergiven up close at Felixstowe. Truly jaw dropping in size. Yes, the end of just in time globalisation but is that such a bad thing?

Now off to my 2nd beer…. I’ll keep the phone off!

Stu
Stu, I'll hazard a guess that 30% of the stuff on board the Evergreen (and all other container ships including and especially those operated by Amazon) is utter shite that has no meaningful place in the world.

Enjoy those beers.
 

lozcb

Member
Messages
12,557
Stu, I'll hazard a guess that 30% of the stuff on board the Evergreen (and all other container ships including and especially those operated by Amazon) is utter shite that has no meaningful place in the world.

Enjoy those beers.
I'll 2nd that Crud sir , how many of us have that same shite 2 years down the line , a very small % I bet , Ive got a cupboard full of shite that was ordered via amazon and not fit for purpose or not the same size as the picture led you to believe ( in case is a 6M Chimney brush i bought that was just about big enough to clean out a drain pipe should i ever require it yawn )
 

gb-gta

Member
Messages
1,139
This may not be my most eloquent reply but have have only had 1 beer here in Phuket so here goes….

I plan never to own or drive and EV unless mandated by law.

Their TCO on the environment including manufacturing is in my humble, terrible.

They are a climate green-washing slight of hand.

The ICE today if you buy new is crazily efficient and emissions are very very low (good use of regulation).

The problem is not the ICE but the fossil fuel you put in it. Solution……

Also did you know that 83% of an ICE car can be recycled, that is amazing.

Ban fossil fuels over 10 years (can’t do quicker) and mandate petroleum producers to produce carbon/capture e-fuels as a replacement. Means that everyone who does not own an electric car or cannot afford one does not have to change their car. It’s a win win for everyone. We also stop mining half of Chile to death for the lithium that’s almost like the 17th century sweet tooth that caused many atrocities….

If that does not work, ban all diesel/fuel munching ships and planes that bring us our goodies from all over the world when we demand them. Have you ever seen the Evergiven up close at Felixstowe. Truly jaw dropping in size. Yes, the end of just in time globalisation but is that such a bad thing?

Now off to my 2nd beer…. I’ll keep the phone off!

Stu
At the risk of being labelled a swivel eyed conspiracy loon, the plan/end game is you don’t own one at all, EV or ICE.

Of course all the consumer cr@p will still be shipped around the world. EV’s are saving nothing, stick with your ICE (and your beer).


IMG_4206.png
 

lozcb

Member
Messages
12,557
At the risk of being labelled a swivel eyed conspiracy loon, the plan/end game is you don’t own one at all, EV or ICE.

Of course all the consumer cr@p will still be shipped around the world. EV’s are saving nothing, stick with your ICE (and your beer).


View attachment 124737
Good luck with that then , Africa is just getting started Klaus , be interesting to see things pan out in Congo and South Sudan , they are just starting to relish the idea of all the old cheap european castoffs Would like to see them take this vehicle away from these guys

1711632962788.jpeg
 

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lozcb

Member
Messages
12,557
Isn't that Nigeria? I wonder if they know how to fix them out there or whether they will be making a return as spare parts!!
Its actually South Sudan , but yeah Nigeria and Ghana are the main stay of stolen high end cars from the UK , Range Rovers would last about a week at best in South Sudan ( its something else ) you wouldnt understand unless you have been there and done a few miles across country ....the place is a relentless obstacle from North to south and east to west , the only trustee steed that seems to have lasted the pace is the proven Toyota Land cuisers 70 series
 

Nibby

Member
Messages
2,089
Good luck with that then , Africa is just getting started Klaus , be interesting to see things pan out in Congo and South Sudan , they are just starting to relish the idea of all the old cheap european castoffs Would like to see them take this vehicle away from these guys

View attachment 124740
Too scary for me I'm afraid if guns are needed.
Have you seen any gorillas in the Congo when you've been there Loz?
 

lozcb

Member
Messages
12,557
Too scary for me I'm afraid if guns are needed.
Have you seen any gorillas in the Congo when you've been there Loz?
Just for your info lol , that truck is mine and I was driving at the time , Did 2 years mining about 60km into the bush/jungle near Kisangani DRC where the renowned benobo chimps are , real fascinating to see their colonies and how they behave ( so close and similar in a lot of respects to humans ) and yes done plenty of exploration in and around the Rwenzori Mountains bordering Uganda/Congo/and Rwanda , I consider myself blessed to have witnessed close up Silverbacks and their wives and families in the weeks i was there testing streambeds etc.